Wednesday, March 26, 2008

Sentencing (March 19, 2008)

My last blog was how I truly feel about all of you and what I think important. For those of you with the faith of Jesus Christ I remind you of His power while the retards glory in their revilings. They think they are oh so smart because their eyes are the great interpreters of spiritual warfare. Sentencing was a great moment for us. As I told you in a past blog there are seven stages a man must pass through in his trials. The fifth stage was judgment. For us this stage began in August and ended on March 18th. The next phase is peace. Now how can the world comprehend this phase? They are thinking I'm getting deserved punishment and that I should be crushed. Wrong again, I am already experiencing peace. Why shouldn't I? I did the work given me faithfully and God has always proven himself faithful. I presented the gospel, remain courageous, and suffer for the kingdom's sake. Will I find justice in this life? I know this is a very important question but should it be asked? I'm not concerned with the answer because I've found mercy and that is too sweet to desire something inferior. We had to listen to a hypocritical windbag tell us we have no respect for the law. This is a known fact of which I do not dispute. There is no way to win my respect away from God and His laws by the opinions and contracts of dead men. God is alive and His precepts are binding. None other are. Mr. Alsup on the other hand believes and finds his purpose in these laws and yet he does not obey them. Who is the lawless one? If he obeyed his laws he would have dismissed instead of giving me 25 years and Scott 22. The reason not more was because he now agreed with me that no financial institutions were factually before the court. A confession also made by the prosecution upon the record. This means the acquittal motion denied after trial must be granted. Is he honest enough for this? Of course not. Punish, punish, though I have no legal right to. This is lawlessness. This is what I testified against with the truth of the spirit. Repentance was offered and again refused. The devil again disguised himself under a false righteousness and all the retards say amen! Few know their God and it is my pleasure to serve you in my calling. Be at peace as I am at peace. Babylon is fallen and faith can function timelessly as it appropriates whatever it needs from the past or the future. I will discuss the practical work before me, what my hands must do in the near future. What I desire for you all now is that you take comfort in our Lord. For in weakness we are made strong. It is a great blessing to be tried and to have a clear conscience that approves you before God. I wouldn't want it any other way. In loss one discovers their gain. This is where revelation begins. It is a paradox that is never experienced by retards who live for themselves through fear. When God makes this kind of call on your life it is for good. Don't let the comfort of the body or the desires of the emotions rule your spirit but let the spirit of the man rule with the help of the Holy Spirit. This is how the world will know that it is condemned. Keep this witness for it is precious. I will keep the blog going though I may reduce the postings for practical reasons. I can tell you that faith never lets things take their own course. Don't be surprised by sudden changes.

102 comments:

notorial dissent said...

The Bilge Report for mar 19, 2008 wherein Kurt expends a great deal of verbal energy to no useful or honest purpose.

great Kurtian comments 1
Sentencing was a great moment for us.

Well, it certainly was the pivotal point for the rest of your life.

great Kurtian comments 2
The next phase is peace.

Yes, the peace and isolation of the jail cell for the next 20 odd years.

great Kurtian comments 3
Will I find justice in this life?

Well, just certainly found you well enough.

As usual, just more Kurtian BS and denial. Kurt didn’t do anything wrong, Kurt is martyred for his convictions, Kurt is right and the rest of the universe is wrong. In other words, just more Kurtian BS. No great surprise. Well look at it like this, you will have the next 20 odd years to sing your laments that no one will hear or care about. Yes, you’ve certainly achieved a lot Kurt, you are a true specimen.

dr. ira gilac said...

"Don't let the comfort of the body or the desires of the emotions rule your spirit but let the spirit of the man rule with the help of the Holy Spirit."





Yes, the HS is being poured out by the bucketfull.Better to go to the well now and fill up while one still can.

Never know when the well will run dry....

Still, there are those who are refusing to go to the well and drink....

Too bad for them....

Any day now, the well could run dry and will thirsty. Too late....

They will begging for water.

Will have to go the recyclyed sewage plant wastewater to drink from. But drinking thsi water will make you sick, very sick, as in terminal.


I am sure that SOP would agree.....

mogel007 said...

Notarial Dissent said: "As usual, just more Kurtian BS and denial."
__________________________________

Notarial Dissent, why can't you just accept that Kurt truly believes in what he is doing and that in his perspective it isn't BS & isn't denial at all since he truly believes in everything he is doing. Isn't that in the realm of possibilities or are you so arrogant you are cock sure here? There are many reasons to believe and show that Kurt doesn't fit the stereotype of the common conartist, but you fail to acknowledge those things , why is that?

Rather than trying to make a moral judgment on Kurt's behaviour, why not try to put yourself in his shoes for a change and try to think in his own perspectives? You obviously don't have that ability at all, do you? Would it hurt you at all, to give someone the benefit of the doubt ever or in the very least to open your mind to other possibilities or what motivates Kurt & Scott?

Oh that's right, because by doing so, it would show character and perserverance on their part, two admirable traits, something you can't subscribe to them at all because you've never considered that possibility that they truly believe they were on an honorable mission from the very beginning.

Have you ever met anyone that seems to rub you the wrong way, but you still know that deep down they usually always have the best of intentions? I doubt you would ever recognize a person like that since you would probably attribute bad behavioural intentions to the very acts you don't understand & dismiss them by mere final judgments. Maybe that's why the Lord commands us not to judge people, because so often we can be mistaken as to real intent & true motivations & simply we can't enter in the hearts of others as mere mortals, unless that gift is temporarily given to us.

Have you ever miserable failed at something in the short term so it seems by the judgment of others, but you knew you had the best of intent in accomplishing another long term objective & were in fact misjudged badly by others, not by the real intent of your actions, but the judgments that resulted by your actions? Of course you've never experienced that either, otherwise, you are just a hypocrite with no sympathy or empathy whatsoever when such traits are called for. Which are you, a poor judge of character and intent, or just a hypocrite, or maybe both? Maybe you are just narcissistic, unable to see beyond yourself? Maybe your great education made you this way?

mogel007 said...

Scott from Vineland, try to visualize this:

http://cosmos.bcst.yahoo.com/
up/player/popup/?rn=3906861&
cl=7131865&ch=4226723&src=news

The problem with Notarial Dissent & you, seems to be that you both have trouble visualizing the truth, maybe because you seem to fight it so much.

mogel007 said...

Makes me wonder what will be more of a shock to Notarial Dissent someday, a Dorean Group victory, or hearing that a man got pregnant in the news?

dr. ira gilac said...

....hearing that a man got pregnant in the news?



Dg notwithstanding, wonder what SOP would have to say about this? (Or even more important, what God would say about it.)


Probably something like, "the end cannot be far off".

And he would probably be right...

dr. ira gilac said...

Wonder if I can spend HYIP money in heaven?

Seem like just when it about to pay, that we are "near the end".
;-)

provb1022 said...

Provb1022

Thanks mogel for expressing thoughts and questions I also had about ND

Scott from Vineland said...

mogel007 said...
Scott from Vineland, try to visualize this:

http://cosmos.bcst.yahoo.com/
up/player/popup/?rn=3906861&
cl=7131865&ch=4226723&src=news
___________________________________
You lost me here, Moogs...Which story did you want me to see?

Scott from Vineland said...

The pregnant man story?

Scott from Vineland said...

Yeah, that story is a real perversion of God's natural order. If you and I can't agree on anything else, Byron, I guess we can agree that this world is in a fast downward spiral. Maybe I'm just not inclined to search for spirtual wickedness in the banking business because there is already so much of it to be found elsewhere.

notorial dissent said...

Moogs, it truly gives me pause that you have either the time, the inclination, or the ability to turn up nonsense like your current caniption. Or that you and Scott would carry on like a couple of old women about it.

In the first place, “he” is genetically and biologically a “she” and always has been, and in the second place it may well be a hoax for the gullible, and we are back to your reading habits again.

I think you would better put to exhibiting your sense or righteous indignation towards a fraud who insists on cloaking his defrauding of the dim and bewildered, all the while claiming to be a good Christian on an inspired mission, all the while making a mockery of the very religion he purports to practice.

notorial dissent said...

and Moogey blathered forth
Notarial Dissent, why can't you just accept that Kurt truly believes in what he is doing and that in his perspective it isn't BS & isn't denial at all since he truly believes in everything he is doing. Isn't that in the realm of possibilities or are you so arrogant you are cock sure here? There are many reasons to believe and show that Kurt doesn't fit the stereotype of the common conartist, but you fail to acknowledge those things , why is that?


Oh, let’s start with the FACT that Kurt has been twice convicted of fraud, that he has lied to and cheated a great number of people over the last five years, or are you forgetting the “clients” who paid him a great deal of money before his house of cards collapsed. The fraudulent mortgage releases, the handful of second mortgages he conned people into taking out when they hadn’t been released from their first mortgage, has he given any of that money back? Has there been any indication that he even contemplated giving it back? Has he even apologized for having defrauded his “clients”? To date I have seen nothing issue from Kurt but bombast, ego, and out and out contempt for the people he defrauded, and everyone else he has come in contact with. Kurt is smarter, Kurt is a genius, Kurt is doing the Lord’s work. BS!!!!! Kurt was serving Kurt’s own ego and lining his own pockets, or at least intended to, but his incredible ineptitude put paid to that as well. The only thing Kurt believes in is that he can con whoever is stupid enough to get close enough to him to listen, and that is the only thing he believes. Kurt didn’t find religion until his other snake oil campaign blew up in his face, and quite frankly I don’t believe this line of BS any more than I believed the first run. He is hiding behind religious flumery the way he hid behind legal flumery before, it is nothing more than a tool and a heavily handled tool at that.

In answer to your question, many things are possible, but since I have yet to see anything that even comes close to contrition or honesty, no I don’t have any doubts. The pretty words Kurt spews now ring just as hollow and false as all the others he spoke.

BS, Kurt is the perfect model of a con man, he has acted the part all his life, the only genuine emotion I have seen him exhibit to date was one of his spewings of bile about his clients and his family, that had the ring of honesty as nothing since has. You are free to delude yourself in whatever manner of fashion you choose, just don’t expect anyone else to take you seriously when the truth is so very obviuos.

and blathered
Rather than trying to make a moral judgment on Kurt's behaviour, why not try to put yourself in his shoes for a change and try to think in his own perspectives? You obviously don't have that ability at all, do you? Would it hurt you at all, to give someone the benefit of the doubt ever or in the very least to open your mind to other possibilities or what motivates Kurt & Scott?

I do not have to make any kind of moral judgement, Moogs, the facts and the truth speak far too eloquently and make it unnecessary. To what purpose, Kurt’s actions and deeds spoke more than adequately as to what his motives were, and in fact to date he has given no one reason not to question his every action. It is not a question of benefit of the doubt, it is his every action that has declared Kurt a liar and a fraud. He carries the sign about him, no one has to go looking for it.

and blathered
Oh that's right, because by doing so, it would show character and perserverance on their part, two admirable traits, something you can't subscribe to them at all because you've never considered that possibility that they truly believe they were on an honorable mission from the very beginning.

So it takes character and perseverance to cheat people out of money they cannot afford to lose, so that they can ultimately lose their homes and this is an admirable trait, you’re right in that respect, it is something I won’t subscribe to or tolerate. Oh please, and Al Capone believed he was an honest businessman.

and blathered some more
Have you ever met anyone that seems to rub you the wrong way, but you still know that deep down they usually always have the best of intentions? I doubt you would ever recognize a person like that since you would probably attribute bad behavioural intentions to the very acts you don't understand & dismiss them by mere final judgments. Maybe that's why the Lord commands us not to judge people, because so often we can be mistaken as to real intent & true motivations & simply we can't enter in the hearts of others as mere mortals, unless that gift is temporarily given to us.

And having good intentions doesn’t alter the fact that they are still obnoxious and tiresome. Your analogy is poorly drawn and even more poorly thought out. I find it interesting that you associate being obnoxious with being criminal. Not enough to pursue it, but still interesting. Otherwise, as usual, a waste of mental effort on your part. There is a difference Moogs between watching a person steal something and knowing them for the thief they are, and judging someone simply because they have poor taste in clothes, but again, probably a strain for you intellect.

and blathered still more and finally shut up
Have you ever miserable failed at something in the short term so it seems by the judgment of others, but you knew you had the best of intent in accomplishing another long term objective & were in fact misjudged badly by others, not by the real intent of your actions, but the judgments that resulted by your actions? Of course you've never experienced that either, otherwise, you are just a hypocrite with no sympathy or empathy whatsoever when such traits are called for. Which are you, a poor judge of character and intent, or just a hypocrite, or maybe both? Maybe you are just narcissistic, unable to see beyond yourself? Maybe your great education made you this way?

Nice try Moogs, but a poor deflection. Robbing a bank, and then saying “Oh, but we didn’t really rob the bank, we were just taking out all the old dirty money to burn it so no one would get sick” makes about as much sense as what dim and dimmer have been trying to pull. There was no higher plan, other than lining their pockets, and the intention all along was to commit fraud, but conning the clients out their fees, and then hopefully getting a cut on the second refinance, all of which were illegal, fraud, and out and out deceit from beginning to end.

notorial dissent said...

The Bilge Report Part 2 for Mar 19, 2008 wherein Kurt expends a great deal of verbal energy to no useful or honest purpose.

great Kurtian comments 4
I did the work given me faithfully and God has always proven himself faithful.

I’m sorry, I seem to have missed the commandment that says go forth and defraud your neighbor.

great Kurtian comments 5
Will I find justice in this life?

Well, justice certainly seems to have found you well enough.

great Kurtian comments 6
We had to listen to a hypocritical windbag tell us we have no respect for the law.() This is a known fact of which I do not dispute.

Those darn facts just keep getting in the road of all your fantasies don’t they?

great Kurtian comments 7
There is no way to win my respect away from God and His laws by the opinions and contracts of dead men. God is alive and His precepts are binding.

Tell us some more about the go out and commit massive fraud precepts Kurt, those are the really interesting ones. I don’t seem to rember the chapters on committing fraud or how to file fraudulent documents being a regular chapter, must be in the Book of Kurt, under fraud and deceit.

great Kurtian comments 8
Mr. Alsup on the other hand believes and finds his purpose in these laws and yet he does not obey them.

Oh, according to who, you? Now there is a sterling charactor witniess if ever I saw one.

great Kurtian comments 9
Who is the lawless one? If he obeyed his laws he would have dismissed instead of giving me 25 years and Scott 22.

You’re incredibly lucky that he practiced some restraint or you would have gotten the 400 years promised earlier.

great Kurtian comments 10
The reason not more was because he now agreed with me that no financial institutions were factually before the court.

And since you were charged with mail fraud, and conspiracy to commit mail fraud there was no reason for them to be.

great Kurtian comments 11
This means the acquittal motion denied after trial must be granted.

Only in your deluded dreams, you were convicted of the charges filed, not ones never brought to trial, you appealed the wrong conviction it would seem.

great Kurtian comments 12
Is he honest enough for this? Of course not. Punish, punish, though I have no legal right to. This is lawlessness.

No, just justice and reality catching up with you.

And when all else fails, fall back on religious gibberish in the hopes that it makes you sound like less of a waste of protoplasm than you are, doesn’t work, but then none of your other scams have either, so nothing new here either.

great Kurtian comments 13
Don't be surprised by sudden changes.

What like your moving from one cell to another

dr. ira gilac said...

Im sure that not even SOP would condone this against the evil bankers.




David Pitt - Associated Press Writer




I told you there would be RETALIATION: Banker and entire family slaughtered

Iowa Banker, Indicted for embezzlement, killed. His whole family was murdered too.

This is the new justice. Forget the wishy washy courts; the mealy-mouth lawyers getting their thieving clients off on technicalities. We The People have had quite enough of that bullshit.

The cops think the Banker killed his family then killed himself in a car wreck later. Gee, pretty neat how it could be made to look like that!

Bankers with their A.R.M.'s that are driving people into foreclosure. . . . . this could be you next. Commodities Brokers that are destroying small businesses and family finances with giant hikes in fuel costs based solely on speculation. . . . . this could be you next. Stock market Brokers who are suckering people into an overheated market with false promises of growth when you know a major "correction" is on the way . . . . . this could be you next.

Street justice is a brutal thing. It's also very effective. You rich folk who think you can do whatever you want to the Middle Class had better think again. We're not nearly as stupid or as weak as you think we are. ~Hal Turner
************************************************

DES MOINES, Iowa (AP) -- A mother and her four children found dead in their Iowa City home were beaten to death, apparently by the father, authorities said Wednesday after autopsy results were released.

Sheryl Sueppel, 42, and the children died of injuries to their upper torsos and heads, Iowa City police said. Two baseball bats found in the home appear to have been used, police said.

Police believe the woman's husband, former bank executive Steven Sueppel, killed her and the children Sunday night or Monday. He had been charged with embezzlement, and his body was found in the wreckage of a car crash Monday.

Investigators say they believe he killed his wife, then tried to kill himself and the children by asphyxiating them with carbon monoxide in the garage. When that failed, he killed the children one by one.

Before he died, Steven Sueppel left a hand-written four-page note in which he detailed the killings. The note was left in the kitchen and apparently was written for surviving family members.

The note, clearly completed after he had killed the entire family, includes details that match evidence found at the scene and the medical examiner's findings, Kelsay said.

"It becomes kind of a moot point whether it was actually a ball bat or some other item," Sgt. Troy Kelsay said. "We're confident we know what happened, and we're not going to talk any more specifics."

The note also reveals some detail about Sueppel's frame of mind and what may have driven the former Hills Bank & Trust vice president and controller to the killings.

Sueppel mentioned in the note the embarrassment and other fallout from criminal charges he faced. A federal grand jury indicted him in February on charges that he stole nearly $560,000 between 2000 and 2007 from the bank.

Although he had pleaded not guilty, court documents indicate Sueppel had told investigators that he had taken hundreds of thousands of dollars and placed it in an account he held at another bank.

Sueppel was free on bond and awaiting trial next month.

In his note, Steve Sueppel discussed his life and the criminal charges, noting that his expected absence from home would leave his wife alone to raise and support Ethan, 10; Seth, 8; Mira, 5; and Eleanor, 3.

The U.S. attorney's office will request that the case against Sueppel be dismissed after it receives a copy of his death certificate, a spokesman said.

hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/I/IOWA_CITY_SLAYINGS

dr. ira gilac said...

A mother and her four children found dead in their Iowa City home were beaten to death, apparently by the father, authorities said Wednesday after autopsy results were released.





yeah, doing this is gong to fix the evil bankers allright.

really. this story is making me sick.

what did this poor mom and children???? to deserve this even if her huband was an evil banker??


all it proves, is just like the pregant guy story, we are "near the end".....



Ive never been in jail, but have "read somewhere" that guy in jail really arent too crasy about people who harm the little ones.

maybe even SOP can beam back down with a bible verse taht actually says something like...

"woe to those who harm the little ones; BETTER THEY HAD A MILLSTONE TIE AROUND THEIR NECK AND THROWN INTO THE SEA"


those millstones used to mill the grain in those days were pretty heavy...but even that would be better than what facing him in the can.


something about getting it "in the end".....

dr. ira gilac said...

and you know what, hal turner you not getting a free pass on this either.


how could you say "this is wahts going to start happening"

waht did the mom and kids do?


really?

wahts the matter with you?


your a real dipsh*t!

mogel007 said...

Oh, let’s start with the FACT that Kurt has been twice convicted of fraud,

FIRST CONVICTION WAS DOING WHAT THE BANKS DO IN ESSENCE, SO NO COOKIE THERE, UNLESS YOU WANT TO CONVICT THE BANKS OF FRAUD TOO. SECOND CONVICTION WILL BE OVERTURNED.

that he has lied to and cheated a great number of people over the last five years,

HE HASN'T LIED ABOUT ANYTHING. YOU CALL A DIFFERENT POINT OF VIEW AN INTENTIONAL LIE. YOU'VE SAID THE SAME THING TO ME TOO. HE HASN'T CHEATED ANYONE SINCE HE INTENDS TO KEEP HIS PROMISES. AGAIN, YOU CAN'T JUDGE INTENT BECAUSE YOU DON'T KNOW THE MAN.

or are you forgetting the “clients” who paid him a great deal of money before his house of cards collapsed.

NO, I HAVEN'T FORGOT ABOUT THAT. A SERVICE WAS PERFORMED & A FEE WAS EXTRACTED. THE SERVICE IS STILL BEING PERFORMED FOR THE END RESULT, SO CHEATING PEOPLE IS JUST A JUDGMENT AT THIS POINT, NOT A FACT.

The fraudulent mortgage releases, the handful of second mortgages he conned people into taking out when they hadn’t been released from their first mortgage,

WHAT WAS FRAUD WAS WHEN THE LENDER CONNED THE ALLEGED BORROWER INTO SIGNING AWAY HIS HOME WHEN THE PROMISSORY NOTE PAID OFF THE HOME, NOT THE LENDERS ASSETS THROUGH A LOAN.

has he given any of that money back?

NO, HE HASN'T GIVEN ANY OF THAT BACK BECAUSE THAT WASN'T THE ORIGINAL AGREEMENT. HAS THE FBI GIVEN BACK THE MONIES THEY CONFISCATED FROM THE DOREAN GROUP BANK ACCOUNTS? WHY DON'T YOU CONDEMN THEM FOR NOT GIVING THOSE MONIES TO THE CLIENTS IF YOU ARE SO CONCERNED ABOUT THE CLIENTS?

Has there been any indication that he even contemplated giving it back?

AS A MATTER OF FACT YES. HE SPOKE OF REFUNDING PEOPLE'S UPFRONT MONIES ONCE THE SETTLEMENTS HAPPENED. DID YOU MISS THAT PROMISE? OBVIOUSLY IN YOUR POOR JUDGMENTS, YOU FORGOT ABOUT THAT.

Has he even apologized for having defrauded his “clients”?

NO, BECAUSE HE BELIEVES THE MAIL FRAUD STATUTUE DOESN'T APPLY AND THE CLIENTS AREN'T THE VICTIMS, SO THERE'S NOTHING TO APOLOGIZE FOR SINCE THE GOVERNMENT AND JURY CAUSED THE CONFUSION OF THE FACTS.

To date I have seen nothing issue from Kurt but bombast, ego, and out and out contempt for the people he defrauded, and everyone else he has come in contact with. Kurt is smarter, Kurt is a genius, Kurt is doing the Lord’s work. BS!!!!! Kurt was serving Kurt’s own ego and lining his own pockets, or at least intended to, but his incredible ineptitude put paid to that as well.

JUST YOUR OPINION.

The only thing Kurt believes in is that he can con whoever is stupid enough to get close enough to him to listen, and that is the only thing he believes.

THIS STATEMENT IS QUITE JUDGMENTAL & TOO SIMPLISTIC TO BE TRUE.

Kurt didn’t find religion until his other snake oil campaign blew up in his face, and quite frankly I don’t believe this line of BS any more than I believed the first run.

YOU ARE WRONG HERE. HE HAS BEEN RELIGIOUS FOR LONGER THAN YOU HAVE BEEN STUDYING LAW.

He is hiding behind religious flumery the way he hid behind legal flumery before, it is nothing more than a tool and a heavily handled tool at that.

HE HIDES BEHIND NOTHING. HE DOESN'T NEED TO.

Dr. Caligari said...

FIRST CONVICTION WAS DOING WHAT THE BANKS DO IN ESSENCE, SO NO COOKIE THERE, UNLESS YOU WANT TO CONVICT THE BANKS OF FRAUD TOO.

Do you have some support for this statement?

SECOND CONVICTION WILL BE OVERTURNED.

Yeah, right. Another prediction to rank with Kurt's "this will all be settled in a week." Forgive me if I lack your confidence in that.

dr. ira gilac said...

In his note, Steve Sueppel discussed his life and the criminal charges,

noting that his expected absence from home would leave his wife alone to raise and support Ethan, 10; Seth, 8; Mira, 5; and Eleanor, 3.








ya, some 'good logic' there.

afraid your wife wont have $$$ to raise your kids and pay the bills.....

"gee, my poor wife...how will she pay the bills and raise the kids with no money???"

"got to figure out a way to help out of this...."

"i know, ill just kill them all, then they wont need any money...."



yep, no question about it.

"a weel jeenious".....

weird that he worked in a bank??

sad...

dr. ira gilac said...

wahts also weird if i recall correctly is arent most of his kids names contained in the bible if i am not mistaken??


mostly the old testament.

i know seth was, but also tought that i rember the other names too somewhere?

mogel007 said...

Dr. Caligari: Here is Kurt's own words as found on the front of his blog. Many people miss this. He never hid his 1st conviction FROM PEOPLE, so when people offer this conviction as proof of him being a habitual felon, I laugh at what they say. It's probably his first conviction that started him off on the path of setting up the Dorean Group. Without this learning experience there, it may have never happened.

It has been said that the banks commit "security fraud" by the very way they do their business.

I don't offer this statement below as proof, but as justification of my prior statement. If you knew all that happened during his first trial, & the specific charges there, maybe you would understand better:

"I have taken on the role of a whistleblower in the American Mortgage Industry because of my prior experience with being prosecuted by the government for securities fraud. I didn't mind doing the time (5yrs. 8mon.) for a crime I didn't commit but I did mind the HYPOCRISY of the mortgage industry DOING EVERYDAY what the government convicted me of and there being no interest."

Dr. Caligari said...

Everyone in prison says they're innocent. If you have any information on what Kurt was actually convicted of, post it. If you don't, then all you're saying is "Kurt says he's innocent so I must believe him." I'm sure you wouldn't take that attitude if a convicted child molestor wanted to babysit your kids.

JDJD said...

MOOGUMS Sez: "It's probably his first conviction that started him off on the path of setting up the Dorean Group. Without this learning experience there, it may have never happened."
-----------------------------
Hmmm. Apparently, he's a slow learner. Last time I think he did about 5 years for Securities Fraud. This time he'll apparently do more than 20. Even Moogs could probably learn faster than that.

Didn't someone say that the classic definition of STUPIDITY (or was it INSANITY?) is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result?

Pauligirl said...

http://www.sacbee.com/content/business/story/13006073p-13852578c.html

Johnson, still the subject of a police search, was sentenced to five years and eight months in prison after being convicted in 1992 of fraud in connection with an investment scam based in Campbell. His father, Hollis Frederick Johnson, was sentenced to seven years, eight months.
In court papers, state investigators said the Johnsons' company, Genesis International Ltd., owed investors millions of dollars when the business was shut down. Investors thought the money would be plowed into businesses throughout Europe. While some investors got their money back, investigators said the money was spent on items like a $227,000 yacht. Another $125,000 was transferred to a bank account in Belize.

neodemes said...

moogie whines:

"...THE LENDER CONNED THE ALLEGED BORROWER INTO SIGNING AWAY HIS HOME WHEN THE PROMISSORY NOTE PAID OFF THE HOME, NOT THE LENDERS ASSETS THROUGH A LOAN"

That sounds as idiotic today as it did the first time I heard it spewed.

Rave on!

notorial dissent said...

let the Moogey blather begin
FIRST CONVICTION WAS DOING WHAT THE BANKS DO IN ESSENCE... SECOND CONVICTION WILL BE OVERTURNED.

First conviction was for securities fraud, and no matter how you want to dress it up he WAS convicted, and it was a crime, and your theory is a proven crock. Overturned?? You mean like his first conviction was, or the civil cases that were a slam dunk, or that this would all be over in a week???? Ya sure youbetcha Moogs, so far your predictions have been batting right down there with dim and dimmer’s, that would be O for all so far, now wouldn’t it???

Moogey blather 1
HE HASN'T LIED ABOUT ANYTHING.

I’m sorry, promising someone that you can eliminate a mortgage is out and out fraud and a lie. You eliminate a mortgage by paying it off.

Moogey blather 2
A SERVICE WAS PERFORMED & A FEE WAS EXTRACTED.

Yes Moogs, a service that was a felony, and a fraud, which makes the whole thing a fraud. A contract to commit a crime is not valid.

Moogey blather 3
WHAT WAS FRAUD WAS WHEN THE LENDER CONNED THE ALLEGED BORROWER INTO SIGNING AWAY HIS HOME WHEN THE PROMISSORY NOTE PAID OFF THE HOME, NOT THE LENDERS ASSETS THROUGH A LOAN.

Again, more BS, and long disproven BS at that.

Moogey blather 4
NO, HE HASN'T GIVEN ANY OF THAT BACK BECAUSE THAT WASN'T THE ORIGINAL AGREEMENT.

Again, a contract to commit a crime is not valid, and the entire agreement in its entirety was predicated on fraud and is therefore unenforceable by either party. So still remains fraud. The Dorean victims will get the opportunity to file claims, but since it would much of the money has gone missing or been spent, they will only get pennies on the dollar.

Moogey blather 5
AS A MATTER OF FACT YES. HE SPOKE OF REFUNDING PEOPLE'S UPFRONT MONIES ONCE THE SETTLEMENTS HAPPENED.

Of course he did, since it was an event that was never going to happen, there was nothing to settle, therefore nothing that could be given back.

Moogey blather 6
NO, BECAUSE HE BELIEVES THE MAIL FRAUD STATUTUE DOESN'T APPLY AND THE CLIENTS AREN'T THE VICTIMS, SO THERE'S NOTHING TO APOLOGIZE FOR SINCE THE GOVERNMENT AND JURY CAUSED THE CONFUSION OF THE FACTS.

What Kurt, or you for that matter, believes is irrelevant, what matters is what the law says, and what can be and was proven before a judge and jury. Their opinions are the ones that count Moogey boy.

Moogey blather 7
JUST YOUR OPINION.

Kurt has to date done nothing but expell large volumes of noxious vaporings, meaning absolutely nothing. The only positive and certain thing in his life at the moment is that he is going to jail for the remainder of his otherwise useless life.

Moogey blather 8
THIS STATEMENT IS QUITE JUDGMENTAL & TOO SIMPLISTIC TO BE TRUE.

Hardly considering the very words out of Kurt’s mouth expressing his contempt for everyone around him.

Moogey blather 9
YOU ARE WRONG HERE. HE HAS BEEN RELIGIOUS FOR LONGER THAN YOU HAVE BEEN STUDYING LAW.

Pity then that he never chose to actually practice it so much as use it to further whatever scheme he was hatching at the moment.

Moogey blather 10
HE HIDES BEHIND NOTHING. HE DOESN'T NEED TO.

Yet whenever he is pressed he falls back on gibberish having nothing to do with the matter at hand, and very little to do with reality.

If this is the best you can do Moogs, you really need to find a new hobby.

Moogs, no one, at least to my recollection, with the exception of you ever said Kurt ever hid his previous conviction, he just very carefully didn’t bring it up until he didn’t have any alternative.

No, Moogs, his first conviction is proof that he is a liar and a fraud, and prone to lying and committing fraud. The second merely confirmed it.

Moogey blather 11
It has been said that the banks commit "security fraud" by the very way they do their business.

It has also been said that Genghis Khan was a poorly socialized adolescent girl. Both statements are equally untrue.

Moogey blather 12
If you knew all that happened during his first trial, & the specific charges there, maybe you would understand better:

So once again, it isn’t Kurt’s fault, someone else made him do it, is that what you are saying? BS

Yetter said...

DEAR LORD. THANK YOU FOR THE BLIND AND THOSE THAT REFUSE TO SEE.THEY ARE TRULY A GIFT TO US ALL. AAAMEN

mogel007 said...

JD: Securities fraud and mail fraud aren't the same thing, anymore than "honest services" equates to bank fraud, so your definition of insanity baffles me when you are trying to see how these things fit here. Kurt's first conviction sounds like "selective prosecution", since banks commit security fraud everyday, just like the 2nd trial was all about "selective prosecution" too since no clients were ever charged with anything. I don't see how Brokers are convicted of conspiracy & how they are any different from regular dorean clients. A fraud is a fraud looking at things from the courts point of view.

The Dorean Group were indicted of bank fraud, only to have these charges dropped. Now that should be the subject of many questions and wonderment.

What I was saying was that Kurt's learning what securities fraud is & all the experience he got in his first trial has helped him in preparing the Dorean Group business model and plan. It's not over yet, and an appeal will be heard & I believe the convictions overturned. AFter all, after Kurt realized how beneficial a guilty verdict would be due to conviction of an innocent man on wrongful & unproven charges of record, he was glad to get the sentence even before the trial started. He said he wanted that & most people didn't understand his motivations then, nor did the jury I'm sure. If there is an overturn of the convictions, he has huge financial damages.

How can anyone of you be certain the convictions will not be overturned? It's not over, & I don't hear any of the naysayers talking about Kurt's defenses either as possible considerations. All they see is their point of view. Well there's two sides to everything. For someone like Nemo to say check & checkmate once the verdict came in, is only a good example of a prejudice mind who refuses to consider appeal opportunities & appeal issues still not discussed or resolved.

mogel007 said...

I don't see the Lord abandoning an innocent man like Kurt & Scott, anymore than the Lord abandoned Daniel in the lions den, or Moses of old in his mission of freeing the house of Israel, or Job who was punished with afflictions & devastation, or Joseph who was sold into Egypt, the same Joseph who was thrown into jail for alleged sexual harrasment of Potifers wife through false testimony. Joseph was given the gift of "interpreting of dreams". This gift helped him to get out of jail in the end because this gift allowed him to be introduced to the Pharoah of Egypt who was very impressed with him who eventually freed him. Likewise the gifts that Kurt & Scott have been blessed with, will be instrumental in them getting out of jail too. The Lord equips who he calls & performs a way for them to accomplish the very mission they have.

It would make no sense to me to exert such great faith & great works like Kurt & Scott have done, only to have the end results fail.

Faith is not something that dies and shrivels up with no hope of redemption, due to your own circumstances or the vain judgments of others.

The gift of peace tells one that in the end the Dorean Group will be victorious.

dr. ira gilac said...

..."in the end" because this





not too far`away....

neodemes said...

moogie ponders:

"I don't see the Lord abandoning an innocent man like Kurt & Scott"

When their appeal fails, and they are demonstrated to be destined to serve their sentences, will you finally shut up?

Doubtful.

Your only recourse will be to maintain that the ptb somehow managed to thwart God's will.

Given your twisted sense of things pertaining to God, you will most likely have cult doctrine to back it up.

Rave on, O' lost one!

ethel said...

Neo,

Please explain how God's will works.

Do good people have bad things happen to them?

Is a long jail sentence a pronouncement of God's judgment?

Please explain how God's will works. I am sure many of us have been seeking this and would appreciate an answer if you have one.

Scott from Vineland said...

notorial dissent said...
Moogs, it truly gives me pause that you have either the time, the inclination, or the ability to turn up nonsense like your current caniption. Or that you and Scott would carry on like a couple of old women about it.

In the first place, “he” is genetically and biologically a “she” and always has been, and in the second place it may well be a hoax for the gullible, and we are back to your reading habits again.
___________________________________
This may well be a hoax as you suggest but some reputable media outlets have picked up on the story so let's say for the sake of argument that it's actually happening. Do you find this OK or normal, ND?

ethel said...

To the people who think Dorean is getting their just reward.....

Why do you accept circumstancial evidence against Kurt, but ignore it against the banks?

Fact.... The bank owners manipulated lawmakers into giving them a monopoly and forced us into an unjust and unwinnable debt game. There is no denying this. The way money is made leaves no possible way for all the debt to be repaid. Whether you disagree with the "vapor money" mortgage theory does not change the fact that there is more money owed than put into circulation. It is impossible to ever repay, and someone is profiting from that. It's called a conspiracy theory, but people will fish for the conspiracy on where Kurt sent money or what he spent it on..... Open your eyes. People type hundreds of responses condeming every word that Kurt posts, but you don't pay any attention to the nonsense the lawmakers and Fed figure heads spew.

Read the headlines, and better yet the back of the pages. We are facing economic collapse and Kurt had nothing to do with it. Quite the opposite he's claiming to be fighting the architects of this death trap money system.

Kurt could formulate this "scam" in a couple of years and you have no problems seeing his motives. But billionaires have been doing this for generations and they have clean motives??? Wake up sheeple.

dr. ira gilac said...

as ive said....


..."near the end......."

dr. ira gilac said...

which end?


the one that dont smell too good.....

happy Jack said...

LOLOLOLOL.I love it ! Sorry I just got on to get the sentence of Kurt Bob. Thank the Lord for keeping that lieing scumbag bastard in jail! He is sooo lazy jail with 3 meals and a bed is what he wants because he does NOT really want to work for an honest wage.The e so called blonde bimbet FAKE WIFIE (GOOD on ya "B"!!!!YOU deserve him Debbie!!.)She will cater to him and do just exactly what he wants and continue to,(choke gag!) ,believe the poor misjudged fella while he continues to play the martor. aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaawww Debbie can bring him boxes of goodies every 4 months or what and when the Pen. lets her haul in..
Yes I have heard it all!!!Kurt Bob has known the Lord longer than dirt or anyone else in the world and they are really good buddies . God only hears him and VV ya know.He has read the Bible a zillion times. Blah Blah Blah! Well Blondie I hope you continue to be sucked in by all his HS because
that is exactly what it is. HS!!!
I hope they send his Happy Ass back to some where really cold and far away from any family. heeheeheee
Ahh yes this has made my day!!!
Yes.... there is a God and he loves me!!!adios Amigos
Happy Estatic Jack!!!lololol
PS Continue your suppositions folks .And by the way 5 years my butt!!! He has been lieing and stealing since he was 11 years old taking papers out of the locked racks when he lived in Florida and selling them.

JDJD said...

Yo, Moogles;
You're right, of course. Kurt is a friggin' GENIUS! And I guess his li'l buddy Scotty isn't far behind.

Fraud is fraud. A thief is a thief, no matter how pious the gibberish he uses to cloak the unfortunate truth. And neither Kurt nor Scott is innocent, though you can assert the contrary proposition until you are blue in the face. It will change nothing.

Clearly it is an understatement for you to say that things "baffle" you and that you "can't understand" what's going on here. Such admissions are self-evident to anyone reading your tiresome apologist ravings.

neodemes said...

Hey Ethel

A new alias enters the game, I see.

God's will is pretty easy to understand...if He wants something to happen, it does.

If Kurt is/was acting upon the call of God to beat up the banking system, than it will be done.

So far, all I see is Kurt's will and an unfortunate turn of events...for Kurt.

I don't believe God had His hand in Kurt's sentencing...Kurt is merely reaping the consequences of what he has sown. All actions have consequences.

hth

notorial dissent said...

Moogey proving yet again that he can’t read
JD: Securities fraud and mail fraud aren't the same thing,

And no one, but you made that claim, now did they? The point being, that fraud is fraud, regardless of the arena played in.

Moogey pronouncing
Kurt's first conviction sounds like "selective prosecution", since banks commit security fraud everyday,

By all means, present some real evidence of this, or else shut up about it. Again the point being that to date your claim has not been proven whereas the mail fraud claim has.

Moogey pronouncing some more
just like the 2nd trial was all about "selective prosecution"

No Moogs, the 2nd trial was about the commission of wholesale fraud, and there was nothing selective about it. The clients/dupes may or may not have realized they were committing fraud, depending upon how smart they were and how much they trusted Kurt. The dim duo on the other hand knew what they were doing.

Moogey pronouncing and still more
The Dorean Group were indicted of bank fraud,

Actually, they were indicted for a whole laundry list of crimes, they were prosecuted for mail fraud which is easy to prove, and carries a very long jail term as the dim duo has now found out.

Moogey trying again
What I was saying was that Kurt's learning what securities fraud is & all the experience he got in his first trial has helped him in preparing the Dorean Group business model and plan.

Yes, he certainly does know how to go to jail, and he will get to for a very long time now. Since he did less well at the second trial than he did at the first I would say he didn’t learn it very well in the end.

Moogey thinking wishfully
It's not over yet, and an appeal will be heard & I believe the convictions overturned.

You believe a lot of silly stuff that isn’t going to happen don’t you. Well, at least you are used to being wrong and disappointed so once isn’t going to ruin your life any more than you have already managed.

Moogey not thinking
AFter all, after Kurt realized how beneficial a guilty verdict would be due to conviction of an innocent man on wrongful & unproven charges of record, he was glad to get the sentence even before the trial started.

Yeah yeah yeah Moogs, what happened to the whole thing would be over in a week? Kurt was tried and convicted by a competent jury, you’re the only one who believes he is innocent despite the mountains of evidence and damaged lives, so just one more hallucination on your part.

Moogey still not thinking
He said he wanted that & most people didn't understand his motivations then, nor did the jury I'm sure. If there is an overturn of the convictions, he has huge financial damages.

More delusions, on the astronomically impossible likelihood of the conviction being overturned, the only result would be him still in jail awaiting another trial, and next time they would go for the whole lot and the result would still be him going back to prison for the rest of his life. Nice fantasy Moogs, just like the settlements that will never happen, there is no recouping for criminal activity. Again your ignorance of judicial process screams out to be laughed at.

Moogey the ever delusional
How can anyone of you be certain the convictions will not be overturned? It's not over, & I don't hear any of the naysayers talking about Kurt's defenses either as possible considerations.

What grounds are they for reversal, Kurt’s personal promise, your wishing really really hard? The evidence is too solid, too public, and too real to go away. And what defense would that be, that Kurt is on a divine mission, doesn’t work for taxes, doubt it’ll float for anything else either.

Moogey the ever disappointed
For someone like Nemo to say check & checkmate once the verdict came in, is only a good example of a prejudice mind who refuses to consider appeal opportunities & appeal issues still not discussed or resolved.

No, just someone seeing the obvious when it is sitting there staring you in the face. No one is ignoring the possibilities, but when all actions so far have been based on fantasy and nonsense, the likelihood of anything meaningful coming to pass is as they say slim and none. He should have at least claimed he was a foreign subsidiary and could only be tried in the World Court.

Moogey the deluded
The gift of peace tells one that in the end the Dorean Group will be victorious.


Rather more likely the gift of self delusion.

scott from vineland
This may well be a hoax as you suggest but some reputable media outlets have picked up on the story so let's say for the sake of argument that it's actually happening. Do you find this OK or normal, ND?

Reputable news outlets regularly pick up nonsense and run it, even when they should know better, and I didn’t say it was happening, I said it was more likely to be an elaborate leg pull, that aside, are you seriously asking me if I think it is OK or normal for a woman/female to be pregnant?


And then we have Ethel for further comic relief

Ethel starts out on a bad footing
Why do you accept circumstancial evidence against Kurt, but ignore it against the banks?


The last time I checked solid hard paper evidence was not considered to be circumstantial. Fraudulent documents are fraudulent documents, and mailing them to commit fraud is mail fraud. So nothing circumstantial there. And this evidence against the banks would be what your girlfriend’s best friend’s brother’s sworn deposition on a tootsie roll wrapper?

Ethel makes another silly statement and slips and falls
Fact.... The bank owners manipulated lawmakers into giving them a monopoly and forced us into an unjust and unwinnable debt game. There is no denying this.

Oh, really, and just what monopoly would this be?? As to denying it, since it doesn’t exist yeah sure.

I’m not going to waste time on the rest of your mish mash since it makes even less sense than Kurt’s nonsense. Since you have neither support or fact to back your statements they are pointless to discuss.

jdjd you are quite correct, a great many thing “baffle” our poor Moogs, most of them have to do with morality, and the rest with reality, and he has a really hard time keeping fact and fiction separated. His best one is that he swears up and down that banks can manufacture money at the stroke of a pen, and yet can’t seem to explain how they can be insolvent and closed. If his pet theory were true, they would just “create” more money, balance their books, and be solvent again, and yet it never seems to happen that way and banks get closed all the time, despite his being convince that they can manufacture money out of thin air.

dr. ira gilac said...

jus' wonerin'.....



if k has not been sent to take down the fraudulent baking system, then....


1) is it gods will to take it down?

2) who has/will god sent to take it down?


maybe we can ask fred mertz?

or ricky?

baaaaa....baaaaa luuuuuuuu...


baaaaaa...baaaaa luuuuu......

dr. ira gilac said...

maybe he will send a breed of vipers....LOL!!!

dr. ira gilac said...

yes, def "near the end"....



fed not happy only controlling money, but soon...banks, sap exchange, commdity futures, waht hand you wip you *ss with...etx.....




Revolution Monday:

The Bankster's Coup
Back in earlier times in America, before the Central Bankers took over, there were lots of financial institutions in the country. Most were fiercely independent and they played a key role in the development of the nation. That was a time when the White House was able to dictate to the banks and financial interests rather than today's mirror/reversed situation where bankers largely tell the government what to do.

Of particular significance are two historical events. One is the history of the Second Bank of the United States, which, after its federal charter was withdrawn, ended up bankrupt in a few years. The key thing to remember is that President Andrew Jackson was so mad at the corruption and attempts to influence government, that he pulled the 'federal charter' of the bank, leading to its demise.

Key point: The President dictated to the Banks, not the other way around.

A second moment of history to be recalled is two days before Christmas 1913 the passage of the Federal Reserve Act. Perhaps the most thoroughly researched book on the forming of the 'Fed" to date has been G. Edwards Griffin's "Creature From Jekyll Island" where the bankers of the day hatched their plans for the monetary takeover of America in a scheme which would, in effect, allow private bankers to charge the country interest on it's own money.

A short video which you can see here, lets some of the secrets out: The Fed's actual owners are secret and the watering down of the purchasing power of the dollar has been successfully 'spun' from theft through watering down to the popular belief that prices go up through a mythical process called "inflation" which was ground into the public mind during the last Great Depression and its aftermath.

Key point: From 1913 until this week, the Fed dealt only with banks.

Now fast forward to this coming Monday when, according to a Reuters dispatch, "The U.S. Treasury will propose...that the Federal Reserve be given sweeping new powers that would make it chief regulator with authority to require actions and to ensure market stability"

Key Point: Having seized control of the currency in 1913, and having sold the notion that prices somehow mysteriously levitate in the general economy independent of the supply of goods, market demand, and supply of money, the bankers club - the not-really Federal Reserve will begin its push Monday to control much more than banking. It's about to seize Wall Street.

In doing so, the Treasury is expected to promote the merging of the Securities and Exchange Commission and the Commodities Futures Trading Commission that oversees the commodities markets.

Oh, and in dabbling their toes in owning (as securities pledge against loans) CMO's and such, the Fed may also have tipped its hat that it's getting into real estate ownership.

Context and Impacts
There are many ways one can describe the Fed's expansion into non-banking financial regulation.

One way is to argue that because of the electronic linkage between markets, its necessary to ensure 'market stability' at all costs, thus justifying the expansion.

On the other hand, as an independent speculator, which I readily confess to being, there's another equally descriptive term: Price Fixing.

The bailout of the financial institutions which we've been witnessing develop over the past year, or so, having arisen out of the mortgage bubble collapse, in pure economic terms should have resulted in the destruction via bankruptcy of the immoral, unethical, and unsound characters who caused the condition.

However, in today's United States, which adheres to a more generally socialist agenda (*e.g. government control and central planning) such self-cleaning properties of American Free enterprise are no longer politically acceptable. It's just not Agenda 21.

Instead of allowing market forces to shut down Bear Stearns, or other "too big to fail" institutions, what we witness instead is the methodical use of taxpayer monies to bail out the morally and otherwise bankrupt firms that gambled too heavily on CMO's, CDO's, SIV's, and the lot, with probable foreknowledge that (wink, wink, nod, nod) there really would be no risk to those making the decisions: The Taxpayers would be writing the checks to cover bad bets, which is where we are today.

In a country where the number of movie and mindless infotainment channels outnumbers the financial channels by perhaps a 200 to 1 ratio, it's understandable, yet sad anyway, that the bankers are using the excuse of "market stability" to enforce price fixing.

Is it possible that the linguistic work of www.halfpasthuman.com which has been pointing to a rebellion/revolution this spring and lasting for several years was not about regular people being priced out of their homes by foreclosures, losing their jobs through offshoring, or walking because gas is headed skyward and instead refers to a banker's coup?
---
Americans have always had a 'silent partner' in their investments. Whether it was a farm in Washington's time, or a Silicon Valley startup in the Internet bubble days, business has always paid some tribute to government in order to secure our greater good.

However, when I stand back and review the longer view, I can't help but notice that government's tribute, as a percentage of the gross, has expanded 20-50 fold since revolutionary days. Simply put, the bankers have been doing a marvelous job of getting a larger and larger piece of the fruits of the enterprising American worker's labors.

I have no doubt - well, OK some - that the Fed Chairman and the Secretary of the Treasury are well-intentioned: They realize that if the banking system were allowed to go through its normal 'self-cleaning cycle' that a lot of damage would be done, and millions would see their retirement accounts evaporate, because the investment community conned everyday folks into a belief that investment advisers and their ilk could make better decisions about what's a sound investment, than could a thoughtful worker who considers carefully where to save and invest.

Well, surprise, surprised, they didn't. They puffed up the books and sold liar's paper. But rather than fess up - with a few well earned visits to the iron-bar hotel, the Fed's bailing out Wall Street. But in return, this deal with the Devil, now turns to a pact to honor the Devil's spawn, the banksters behind the scenes... the 30% interest crowd.

Thus, as the era of American capitalism comes to an end, we see the institution of American socialism in its rawest price fixing mode entering the scene. Like junkies hooked on smack, the American worker has been fattened by the bankers of cheap credit, and absent assent to a slaughter of our freedom, we'll be beggared and bankrupted one-by-one and sent to tent cities where colored wrist bands will mark those allowed into the Bush presidency's hidden Hoovervilles.

Monday will also mark, if there had been any doubt previously, the end of the Republican Party that I grew up with. There was a time when the GOP stood for small central government, a progressive civil rights stance, strong belief in states rights, and minimal foreign entanglements along with strict adherence - to the letter - of the greatest Nation founding document ever.

Gee, I don't suppose you have any idea where the real Republican Party is, do you? I routinely call the current batch of pretenders "republicorps" because the universal solution to all problems in the country has been more laws, more governance, and oh, by the by, a bigger share for your silent partner.

The myth also persists that that there is an opposition party, the Democratic Party. Yet I continue to call this party the 'democorps." Why? Because the democorps, like the republicorp have their hands so far into the corporate cookie jars and have succumbed to PAC attacks to such a large extent, that genuine change of a policy found lacking can no longer be achieved because the money and 'grease' rules the day; the grease being voter turnouts promised by the PAC's, the campaign workers supplied, and so forth.

So, Monday the Revolution begins. Bankers will promote their socialist / price fixing, total government control of markets under the guise of 'saving us' from misdeeds by people who have made what are called 'errors in investment judgments'. In an earlier time, it would have been called fraud or rampant speculations and people would be fired, bankrupted, jailed, or hung for such breach of the public trust.

"Market Stability" is like pregnancy: You're either price fixing, or your not.
---
I've been writing about since 1995 about the economic future of America. You can find papers and notes I've made all the way back to 1997 in the library on this site. At it's core, this site has been watching for the painful - but manageable - wringing out of malinvestment from the system so that America can go through its periodic rebirth, formerly happening in long wave economic pivotal years like the Panic of 1873 and then the Depression of the 1930's.

In Biblical times, these were Jubilee Years (go reread Leviticus) and all debts were forgiven. In modern days, it was Long Wave Economics, but the same principles of death and rebirth continued.

Most weekends I offer a summary of various news events, a little contexting to maybe help you see the way to the future more clearly. But this weekend, there is only one story. ^There's a revolution coming Monday.
---
America has one of its most important decisions ever just ahead. Although it may be summarized incorrectly here, my view is that it comes down to a choice between two alternatives that demand your most solemn consideration.

We can, on the one hand, accept the proposals put forth by what I refer to as the corpgov and banksters. In accepting their proffered solution, we will be agreeing to more government and what's worse, more government control of private enterprise. With it will come further price fixing of financial markets via the interventions of the Plunge Protection Team, more formally the President's Working Group on Markets.

The outcome here will be a complete government stranglehold on your finances, assuring that without perfect cooperation with the system, you and your descendants will be "subjects" of the system rather than Free Men and Women. You'll be told where to work, what to think, and how to act to a much greater extent than even now because as history has taught us, absolute power5 corrupts absolutely.

The other outcome, which I admit is much less likely but the one I personally favor, is to take the other path. The one both political parties (before corporate subversion) followed: Strictly allegiance to the Constitution, the Bill of Rights, and a balance between the legislative, executive and judicial branches. Oh, did I mention sound money?

The problem with this path is will hurt - and maybe a lot: People will lose savings, but the flip side is the bankers can be brought to heel; the spiraling growth of government can be slowed. Maybe even reversed. Freedom - in the purest sense of the Framers - can be preserved. Or, it can be lost forever.

By the way; it never occurred to me to put it into a web browser, but see what happens when you click on www.usconstitition.gov or www.billofrights.gov. Nothing! Is this some kind of a hint? Is the outcome already assured?
---
I've chosen with my wife to live in a remote part of East Texas because of the spirit of the place. We don't have credit card debt, and we have voluntarily eschewed the 'flash and bling' media pimped lifestyle based on debt and excessive personal consumption. In a word, we've tried to 'unplug' from the mainstream a bit. No texting, no long commute, no twice weekly trips to big-name department stores, fewer prepared foods. Instead, we have a garden, raise a few animals, and pay our taxes.

The people out here are more 'real' than citified folks. The idea that a person's value is implicit in his vehicle, clothes, brand of cell phone even, well, that's just patently absurd. Strangely, with enough media hype, exactly that kind of thinking seems to prevail in many urban areas, though. We've decided to voluntarily downscale.
---

So the Banker's Revolution begins Monday and the choice is simple:
We can take the easy way which means more government and a furtherance of the recent price fixing in markets...I'm sorry; maintenance of market stability. Come to the great casino, no losers here. Good times, but more regulations, less freedom of choice and a bigger and meaner Big Brother. Did someone over there lose? Well, you just chip in and pay for their losses. The house will keep a share for its hard work, of course.
Or, we can take the hard path and limit bankers, contain government, hold greedy speculators accountable, and let the markets clean themselves. And if we make bad choices, we will live with those. Hard times for a while, but 30% interest rates can be beaten back to 8%, states can legislate usury, and the wealthy elite 'ruling class' can be sent packing: Those who would export our jobs, leave our borders unfenced, and abdicate their responsibilities to preserve sound money, are welcome to leave.

So give it some thought this weekend. Which side will you choose? Soft and Easy but totally Ruled, or Hard and Thrifty - yet FREE?

Let me know your thoughts. It might make an interesting Monday article if anyone responds. Send comments to george@ure.net.

I'll leave you with three quotes that may help your deliberations on this momentous moment, which will surely pass unmarked by MainStreamMedia:

Winston Churchill's "I have nothing to offer but blood, toil, tears, and sweat."

Karl Marx's "From each according to his abilities, to each according to his needs."

And the most prescient of all: The Walt Kelly Cartoon character Pogo:
"We have met the enemy and he is us."
There is no other story this weekend that even comes close to the magnitude of this one.

dr. ira gilac said...

Key point:

From 1913 until this week, the Fed dealt only with banks.





soon they will deal with turlet paper companys....


will tell them not to sell turlet paper to those who are left-handed ^ss wipers.
only the right handed can buy or sell...make them show ID say which hand wip they %ss with.

dr. ira gilac said...

fed gets into the sap market, take all you money out of stox.


their manipulation will GUARANTEE A CRASH LIKE '29 BECASUE THE 'INSIDERS" WILL KNOW WHICH STOX WILL BENEFIT AND WHIHC ONES THE FED WILL LET SINK.

TELL ALL YOU KNOW TO TAKE ALL MONEY OUT OF STOCKS!!

NOW!!!!!



satan is being very thourough here. he is not letting any aspect of destruction get a 'pass'

stox, bonds, real estate, commodities, corn, rice, grains,


if you think you can make money off of it, he is coming after you to disrupt it.


doing well with a lemonade stand??

dont worry, youre next.

digging for periwinkles....just wait...


beachcombing for gold trinkets....youre on the list..



you get the point, nothing will be left. there are those who are saying that all this turmoil isnt affectin them...(lemonade stand) dont worry, it will get around to you....




and rember, dont go in for the mortgage forgiveness when its offered, because you were critical of it now....we know who you are, becasue we got all you IPs traced...even those who think that they are behind a securre anonymous proxy....just like microsoft does...we got "backdoors" there too. ;-)

dr. ira gilac said...

LOL!!!



Secure Anonymous Proxy = SAP!

mogel007 said...

Notarial Dissent said: "The clients/dupes may or may not have realized they were committing fraud,"
______________________________

Sure, the clients were committing fraud against themselves if that's even possible! Since the client was the victim of the alleged mail fraud, according to the jury, not the banks, since the banks provided no financial damages or witnesses on the court records, this must be true. LOL

I would say almost every client & every Broker that joined the process initially believed that the dorean process was legal or they wouldn't have joined. Most people don't believe they were duped even now. The client believed that the bank used their promissory note without authorization & without just compensation, so if anything the banks were the one's commiting fraud against them, the borrower.

The client also knew it wouldn't be a cake walk & that the process was admittedly "controversial" according to the Dorean Group and that the lenders response to the presentment was not uniform in all cases.

It wasn't until federal charges were filed that some people may have changed their minds on whether they should have joined or not, but that was based upon fear, not based upon any legal facts. Also the Dorean Group never believed that criminal charges would ever be filed, until it became a reality and a fact. They claimed, said & believed, it would be the stupidest thing that the government could do to bring criminal charges. When the Dorean Group's business was raided, and eventually shut down, most clients felt indignant, not surprised or feeling it was legally justified.

You're telling me that clients deciding to join the process couldn't or didn't see a copy of the discharge of mortgage from the County Recorder from others that preceeded them, that claimed success, to see that the signature on the document wasn't anyone other than Scott Heineman & that most clients were too stupid to figure out what that might mean. The process was touted as being CONFRONTATIONAL & that the banks would probably fight things. You're also telling me that people joined the process in innocence & ignornace, not knowing how the process worked or what the so called "proven process" was all about & what the believed legal justification was for a Dorean trustee to sign & file certain documents? You're also telling me that most clients wishing to join the process didn't ask any questions when they saw a discharge of mortgage or deed of reconveyance, substitution of trustee or power of attorney document, or even wondered why the Dorean Group could be successful in their minds?

The Dorean Group didn't believe they were committing fraud, & still don't, & were willing to take huge risks, so why should the clients believe that the process was fraudulent or think they were put in a position where they were duped?

If anything, most clients believe that the government let them down by protecting the fraud of the banks & the actions they have taken thus far.

However, the clients had a wealth of information to know how things work, so your belief that most clients joined the process in ignorance, & were duped and may not have known that there could be risks, and uncertainties, is just plain nonsense, so the idea of "selective prosecution" that happened is still true.

The unique Dorean Bond, backed by real assets, and the idea of agency by estoppel to discharge a mortgage was something that had never been done before, to justify discharging a mortgage, so for a client to be totally innocent & not to ask any questions about a new process, makes no sense when describing a client as someone that was duped.

I think you are the one that's being silly or stupid if you believe clients joined the process knowing nothing when there were plenty of websites & conferences that explained the process in detail, so the idea of clients being duped by no education, is just nonsense. Clients made an intelligent choice. Do you think most people give away $3,000 knowing nothing about what service they are getting? How about all of the documents that a client signed prior to the process? Do you also think clients didn't read them? Do you think clients were also unable to obtain their own legal counsel if they chose to?

As for your comment about banks going solvent, banks can create money, but within limits & rules that are set up, so they CAN'T create money at will indefinitely whenever they want and as much as they want, SO YOUR PROBLEM IS WITH YOUR OWN BAD ASSUMPTIONS you start with. Banks go under just like any other business that goes bankrupt when they mismanage their business & take bad risks & their expenses become higher than their income and their liabilities exceed their assets & they find that they are unable to pay their bills timely or unable to borrow what they need due to their credit rating. Do all banks have the same credit rating? Maybe your real education didn't teach you enough just judging by your silly questions & comments.

Pauligirl said...

mogel007 said...
However, the clients had a wealth of information to know how things work, so your belief that most clients joined the process in ignorance, & were duped and may not have known that there could be risks, and uncertainties, is just plain nonsense, so the idea of "selective prosecution" that happened is still true.

-------------------------------
Actually, what the clients had was a wealth of misinformation.
The process was advertised as "There is now a PROVEN legal and moral way of eliminating your mortgage while adding $32k* to your pocket."
What does the word "PROVEN" mean to you?

------------------------------
mogel007 said... You're telling me that clients deciding to join the process couldn't or didn't see a copy of the discharge of mortgage from the County Recorder from others that preceeded them, that claimed success, to see that the signature on the document wasn't anyone other than Scott Heineman & that most clients were too stupid to figure out what that might mean.

----------------------------------
Yeap. The clients didn't have a clue because they were continually lied to. You, Kurt and Scott, the brokers, all held this paperwork up saying see, the mortgage is canceled, says so right here at the register, when all it was, was a bogus piece of paper.

You, Kurt and Scott and the brokers made money off of peoples's fears and ignorance and some greed.. All of you involved in selling this caused some people to lose their homes and others to get even further behind.

Kurt's not capable of it, but you ought to be ashamed.

Judge Roy Bean said...

Gashler, after all this, do you still have your recommend?

Or does your bishop still not know you're a promoter and a defender of a scam two people got multi-year Federal sentences for?

Inquiring minds want to know.

Judge Roy Bean said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Scott from Vineland said...

ND said...
are you seriously asking me if I think it is OK or normal for a woman/female to be pregnant?
_____________________________________
Fine, dude... whatever. So maybe transgendered "men" don't always have all the male equipment installed. You're not going to convince me that this "couple" isn't violating God's original intentions for their lives. And now they want a kid. How sweet! So what if there really is a child born to this pair and it's a boy? "Daddy, how come I have a penis and you don't?" "Daddy, if you don't have a penis, I don't want mine either!" Defend or disregard the precedent here if you want but if you ask me, it's just plain evil to fuck with a kid's sexual identity this way. People who chose to live this way should not be ALLOWED to have kids. End of story.

ethel said...

Neo,

It's that simple huh? Everything that happens on Earth is God's will?

Why did Jesus pray that God's will be done on Earth as it IS in heaven?

You think every evil thing perpetrated on earth is God's will?

God can use evil things for good, but He didn't want them to happen. Was it God's will for adam to sin? Was it God's will for satan to sin?

So whatever happens is Gods will. Ever read foxes book of martyrs?

I think you have an oversimplified theology if you think so....

If things are good, God is blessing it. If things are bad God is judging it?????

ethel said...

ND,

You are an arrogant liar.

To clarify the circumstancial evidence is what the money was spent on or where it was saved. You and others say, Kurt sent money overseas so that proves it's a scam, or he blew the money on a boat so he must be a criminal.

Secondly. Please explain how the creation of money from congress happens.

Is there interest added to the principal created?

If so how can the interest be repaid without creating additional money?

And your know it all arrogant crap is getting old. Answer those simple questions without your stupid commentaries.

dr. ira gilac said...

and speaking of 9/11....

is waht happen in 1945 a preview of what happen in 9/11/01???


raise you hands^

how many of you no that in

july 1945, a B-25 BOMBER crash into the UMPIRE STATE BIULING???

you know, that building where all the umpires hang out discussin' bad calls that they made.

it crash into the 79th floor.



now how a B-25 BOMBER crash into the empire state builidng????


true story.


i no, i no....it was fog....



why thsi never reported in the control news networks?

dr. ira gilac said...

The B-25 that Crashed Into the Empire State Building
Written by Alan Bellows on July 12th, 2006 at 4:02 pm


From DamnInteresting.com



B-25 Bomber On a Saturday morning in July of 1945, Army Air Corps bomber pilot Lt. Colonel William Smith was trying to fly his B-25 bomber through a steadily increasing fog. He was on his way to Newark airport to pick up his commanding officer when he appeared above New York Municipal airport (now La Guardia airport) about 25 miles to the east of his destination. He was requesting a weather report.

Municipal tower reported extremely poor visibility over New York, and urged him to land, but Lt. Colonel Smith requested and received clearance from the military to continue his flight. "From where I'm sitting," the tower operator warned, "I can't see the top of the Empire State Building." Despite the advice from the Municipal tower, Smith plunged into the soupy fog with his two crewmen, bound for Manhattan.

Partway through their flight, the pilot quickly became disoriented because he was unable to see the ground below, and he lost his way. Despite Manhattan regulations that forbade aircraft from flying below 2,000 feet, Smith made the decision to drop below 1,000 feet in an attempt to untangle his bomber from the densest part of the fog. When his plane emerged from the thick, his visibility indeed improved. All around his aircraft, silhouettes of skyscrapers towered above Smith and his crew… and the New York Central Building was directly ahead.

Smith reacted quickly and banked hard, pushing the lumbering bomber to its stress limits to try to avoid the collision. His plane just missed the New York Central Building, flying past its west side with little room to spare. Dozens of skyscrapers lay beyond the first one, leaving a forest of fog-shrouded towers in the plane's path. Smith tried to gain altitude as he weaved between the ghostly shadows of buildings, forcing the bomber to maneuver at its operational extremes.

B-25 CrashWhen the Empire State Building emerged from the fog right ahead of his craft, Smith banked his plane and pulled back as hard as he was able, but the bomber lacked the maneuverability to dodge the large tower looming over it. At 9:49 a.m, in the middle of a desperate, climbing turn, the ten-ton B-25 slammed into the 79th floor of the Empire State Building.

Inside, workers for the War Relief Services of the National Catholic Welfare Conference had already started work when their offices were suddenly engulfed an an explosion of flaming, high-octane fuel. The burning gasoline traveled through hallways, stairwells, and elevator shafts, reaching as far as four floors below the point of impact as the building shook. A publicist working in the offices was propelled out of a window from the explosion, and ten others were caught in the inferno.

Fire and debris rained upon the surrounding area, mostly onto nearby structures. One of the bomber's engines completely penetrated the Empire State Building, and fell from the opposite side. The other engine flew into an elevator shaft and severed the cable of an elevator car carrying two women, sending it into free fall.

Catherine O'Connor, who was working in the offices at the time of the crash, later recounted her experience:
"The plane exploded within the building. There were five or six seconds– I was tottering on my feet trying to keep my balance– and three-quarters of the office was instantaneously consumed in this sheet of flame. One man was standing inside the flame. I could see him. It was a co-worker, Joe Fountain. His whole body was on fire. I kept calling to him, 'Come on, Joe; come on, Joe.'" He walked out of it.

Doris Pope, also in the building at the time, initially suspected that World War 2 had been brought to American soil:
"That day, as we were getting ready to take our coffee break, we heard this terrible noise, and the building started to shake. … As we looked out our third-floor window, we saw debris fall on to the street. We immediately thought New York was being bombed."



see link for rest of story.


www.damninteresting.com/
?p=179

dr. ira gilac said...

chek it out. some very nice pics of the building.



and while you at it....



umpire state building much older than the WTC builidngs...


SO WHY NOT THE UMPIRE STATE BUILDING COOLAPSE ALL THE WAY DOWN TO THE GROUND??

WAS THE BULDINGS IN THOSE DAYS MADE BETTER THE MODERN ONES?

ALL IT DID WAS MAKE A BIG HOLE IN THE BULDING.


ANOTHER 9/11 BS STORY EXPOSED BY THIS MINI 9/11 HAPPEN OVER 60 YEARS AGO.

dr. ira gilac said...

hole in the building


www.damninteresting.com/
wp-content/empirecrash.jpg

dr. ira gilac said...

The impact left a hole in the north face of the Empire State Building eighteen feet wide by twenty feet high. Photographer Ernie Sisto captured this incredible image from the 90th floor, where he had two other newsmen dangle him out the window by his legs so he could get the shot past the ledge. Later in the day, a news broadcast by Mutual Broadcasting Company included interviews with eyewitnesses, as well as an audio recording of the crash which had been accidentally captured by a nearby recording studio.

Investigation showed that the structural integrity of the Empire State Building was not compromised by this accident, but the cost to repair the damage was on the order of a million dollars. For more information, you might check your local library for old copies of New York daily newspapers on microfilm; this was front page news in New York City on July 29, 1945.

MP3 of Mutual News broadcast about the event (1.43MB)

neodemes said...

Ethel, you must have graduated from the Gashler school of comprehension.

I said:

"God's will is pretty easy to understand...if He wants something to happen, it does."

Ethel responded:

"It's that simple huh? Everything that happens on Earth is God's will?"

Did I say that? No, I did not.

Therefore, your ensuing diatribe is meaningless. I don't know who you are ranting to/about, but it has nothing to do with anything I said.

No surprise there.

ethel said...

Ethel, you must have graduated from the Gashler school of comprehension.

I said:

"God's will is pretty easy to understand...if He wants something to happen, it does."

Ethel responded:

"It's that simple huh? Everything that happens on Earth is God's will?"

Did I say that? No, I did not.


Ok, lets look at this.....
"If he wants something to happen it does"

If something happens he wanted it to happen.

Are those 2 statements in opposition?

No rants, just questions. And actually they are clarifying questions. Maybe you have an issue with comprehension.

neodemes said...

Twist and turn as you may, you won't put words in my mouth.

Your two statements are not equal and I only said one of them.

Try again.

ethel said...

NEO,

"God's will is pretty easy to understand...if He wants something to happen, it does."

OK,

If HE doesn't want something to happen does it happen?

I'm not trying to put words in your mouth. I don't think you've contemplated the reality of what you did say. Just looking at it from a different angle to get more meaning. You're free to clarify if you like. Seems like you just want to play games though. I asked you a serious question.

dr. ira gilac said...

Now comes announcements Monday that PAULSON wants Congress to give the FED RES even greater power by reducing the regulatory authority of such existing entities as the SEC. Not more regulation mind you, just put what regulation there is into the hands of the most corrupt organization in the history of the world, the FED RES. Remember, this is a privately owned Banking Cartel not an agency of the government. Congress can't even audit the FED yet their incestuous relationship now expands to include all types of financial institutions from equity buyout companies to hedge funds. Watch for SINCLAIR and other professionals to take on this subject in the next few days.
As to the claims the FED is broke, Fox interviewed a smart fellow Thursday who twice said the FED has 900B on its balance sheet only 400B of which has so far been committed to the bailout. AND, don't forget, they can "create money out of thin air". There is no such thing as the FED running out of money. The debt ceiling, increased "automatically" every six months by the Congress, is a limit upon the government not the FED RES.









"AND, don't forget, they can "create money out of thin air". There is no such thing as the FED running out of money."



ssshhhhh....don tell anynone here thay crate muney out thick air....they wont bleeve you.


LOL! you mean they might run out of ink? don worry, i send them a couple of extra printer ink catridges that i dont use. i picked them up at office despot.


or maybe what you realy meen is the FED run out of computer memroy to make thin air money from book entries in their computer. dont worry that either. i send a a few 1 terabyte external hardrives for their compure so they can use more memory to create their digit money.

done.

neodemes said...

Define "want".

If you jump off a bridge, I don't imagine God would really "want" you to splatter on the rocks below.

However, due to the laws of physics, resulting from the Creation process, splattering will be the end result.

Could God "will" a different result?

Sure. He's God.

Would He do that?

I highly doubt it.

hth

notorial dissent said...

just when I think Moogey has run out of dumb things to say
Sure, the clients were committing fraud against themselves if that's even possible! Since the client was the victim of the alleged mail fraud, according to the jury, not the banks, since the banks provided no financial damages or witnesses on the court records, this must be true.

When you come up with gibberish you do it so well. No one ever said the clients were committing fraud against themselves, they WERE committing fraud by letting Kurt issue the false releases, and if they took out a second loan based on the property being clear they were committing fraud a second time. There was never any statement that the clients were the victim of mail fraud, excepting that the mails were used in some cases to separate them from their money. The rest is gibberish even for you and makes no sense.

Moogey makes another funny
I would say almost every client & every Broker that joined the process initially believed that the dorean process was legal or they wouldn't have joined.

I will agree with the first part, I don’t thing the clients initially realized what they were getting into, I would question it as far as the brokers are concerned, at least one or two, with the exception of you, had to have known better. One of the things Kurt was counting on was the naivite and general lack of sophistication of his clients/victims, and for the most part it worked. Some people are also to stupid to walk and chew gum at the same time.

and yet another
The client also knew it wouldn't be a cake walk & that the process was admittedly "controversial" according to the Dorean Group and that the lenders response to the presentment was not uniform in all cases.

This is a bold faced lie since they were promised it was “proven” and “sure fire” which of course was a lie, and they were promised that it would be completed in as little as 90 days.

and still another
When the Dorean Group's business was raided, and eventually shut down, most clients felt indignant, not surprised or feeling it was legally justified.

Which generally happens when one has done something sufficiently foolish enough that it is too embarrassing to admit you have been a fool.


and tries yet again to avoid the obvious
You're telling me that clients deciding to join the process couldn't or didn't see a copy of the discharge of mortgage from the County Recorder from others that preceeded them, that claimed success, to see that the signature on the document wasn't anyone other than Scott Heineman & that most clients were too stupid to figure out what that might mean.

No, never made or implied any such thing. I do not believe they ever got the opportunity to actually look at any of the paperwork, and in a sense yes, I do think they were too stupid/scared/naive/unsophisticated to have a clue as to what they were even looking at. If they couldn’t figure out that the presentment was a piece of claptrap and that the bond was a crock, and hadn’t bothered to actually read either the note or trust deed they signed at closing, why should they be able to make any sense out of the nonsense Kurt was throwing at them. It was a con job from beginning to end.

and proves he missed the entire point
You're also telling me that people joined the process in innocence & ignornace, not knowing how the process worked or what the so called "proven process" was all about & what the believed legal justification was for a Dorean trustee to sign & file certain documents?

For a long winded collection of drivel, got it in one Moogey boy.

and couldn’t find this one with both hands
You're also telling me that most clients wishing to join the process didn't ask any questions when they saw a discharge of mortgage or deed of reconveyance, substitution of trustee or power of attorney document, or even wondered why the Dorean Group could be successful in their minds?

Got it in two Moogster, they didn’t know what they were looking at, they wanted to believe, and they had oh so charming and sincere Kurt telling them it would all be alright if they would just trust him.

and still doesn’t see
The Dorean Group didn't believe they were committing fraud, & still don't, & were willing to take huge risks, so why should the clients believe that the process was fraudulent or think they were put in a position where they were duped?

BS. It was a con from beginning to end, the only problem is that the con artists didn’t know when to bail and got caught.

or want to see
If anything, most clients believe that the government let them down by protecting the fraud of the banks & the actions they have taken thus far.

The fact that they were stupid enough to let themselves get gulled by Kurt answers that pretty well on its own and means they really haven’t got a clue to begin with.

and then tries to pretend otherwise
However, the clients had a wealth of information to know how things work, so your belief that most clients joined the process in ignorance, & were duped and may not have known that there could be risks, and uncertainties, is just plain nonsense,

BS again. They were provided with a bunch of fabrications and fictions that had no basis in reality, and they were too stupid to actually check it out because it coincided with what they wanted to believe at the time.

back on an old false trail
The unique Dorean Bond, backed by real assets, and the idea of agency by estoppel to discharge a mortgage was something that had never been done before, to justify discharging a mortgage, so for a client to be totally innocent & not to ask any questions about a new process, makes no sense when describing a client as someone that was duped.

Yeah, unique is a good word for it, except it wasn’t, it wasn’t even a good cut and paste job. The first rule of thumb when you are going to do a stock con is to invest in some good quality certificate paper, not some half assed garbage you run off on your cheap printer. The “bond” looked like what it was, a fraud, there were no assets backing it, and there has to be an agency before there can be estoppel, and hardly original, it is called fraudulent issuance of spurius documents.

still clueless
I think you are the one that's being silly or stupid if you believe clients joined the process knowing nothing when there were plenty of websites & conferences that explained the process in detail, so the idea of clients being duped by no education, is just nonsense.

What the websites didn’t explain was that the process was a crock and would end in their being foreclosed on and since they didn’t bother to check anything other than what they wanted to hear, bright is not an adjective I would use to describe any of them.

having yet again missed the boat
As for your comment about banks going solvent, banks can create money, but within limits & rules that are set up, so they CAN'T create money at will indefinitely whenever they want and as much as they want, SO YOUR PROBLEM IS WITH YOUR OWN BAD ASSUMPTIONS you start with.

The word Moogs is INSOLVENT, oh, so now there are rules and limits, but just before you swore they could create all the money they wanted, which is exactly the opposite of what you have been arguing all along. Either they can create money at will or they can’t, there is no maybe if it suits my argument of the moment. Banks go under because they loan out money they can’t recover and when they have lost enough of it they are insolvent. That is how it works, and has worked since the dawn of banking Moogs, you are the one who refuses to face reality.

notorial dissent said...

Scott from Vineland said...
Fine, dude... whatever. So maybe transgendered "men" don't always have all the male equipment installed. You're not going to convince me that this "couple" isn't violating God's original intentions for their lives.

Alright, assuming this isn’t a hoax, and I’m not saying for one minute that I believe it, but again, assuming that it isn’t a hoax, then what has been said must be taken at face value.

I have no intention of trying to convince you of anything. As to original intentions, I think it is you who is assuming a lot. Whether you believe in free will or determinism it comes down to making a determination that is none of your concern. Certain of the religious I know are adamant in their belief that the sole and only purpose of marriage is procreation, and in this case, the one who can is. Sexual identity is not something that changes at will, so that argument is pointless. Children are remarkable things, they generally survive in spite of their parents, not because of them. I will leave you with one final thought, if Daddy came home from the war minus his equipment, would you have the balls to make the same stupid statement you did previously?

notorial dissent said...

Ethel, I’m impressed, your nose hairs twitch almost as violently as Moogey’s when he gets on a rant, and you make almost as much sense as he does, which is to say none.

Ethel explodes
You are an arrogant liar.

Oh, do elaborate? I can hardly wait.

Ethel expounds
Kurt sent money overseas so that proves it's a scam, or he blew the money on a boat so he must be a criminal.

Amazing, out of a paragraph of gibberish, two coherent and true statements.

Ethel exudes
Secondly. Please explain how the creation of money from congress happens.

Since it doesn’t, your point is?

Ethel eludes
Is there interest added to the principal created? If so how can the interest be repaid without creating additional money?

Do you have any clue about what you are talking about since no one else does?

Ethel ends at last
Answer those simple questions without your stupid commentaries.

Try asking a coherent question based on the real world and we’ll see.

happy Jack said...

Well now has anyone EVER heard of FREE WILL. DUH!!! God is just sitting in the background watching greedy selfish fools like Kurt and Scott make all these mistakes and some actually believed his Bull s----They were preying(pun) on O.P.S (other people's) greed and selfishness .
Kurt would sit and snicker about all the "dumbies" and make fun of them for believing him. I couldn't believe some folks took him seriously.
Geez.... I noticed no one made any comments about my prior remarks.
If I wrote all I know it would make all of you ill.
Oh well Have a good one and don't fly too low in the fog esp. in New York. heehee Or you're in Japan you might run in to Gonzilla....LOLOLO
Later days and better lays,
Happy Jack
PS Hi Scott from V land

dr. ira gilac said...

"From where I'm sitting," the tower operator warned, "I can't see the top of the Empire State Building."




dont worry, neither could the pilot....


(sorry, cant help it!!)

ethel said...

Neo said,

Define "want".

If you jump off a bridge, I don't imagine God would really "want" you to splatter on the rocks below.

However, due to the laws of physics, resulting from the Creation process, splattering will be the end result.

Could God "will" a different result?

Sure. He's God.

Would He do that?

I highly doubt it.

hth


The word "want" came from you, so I am not going to define it.

God's will is that all should come to repentance and that none should perish, but attain everlasting life through Christ.

However, many don't. I really don't know how to reconcile that with whatever God wills happens. Is the will of God ever thwarted? Is God ever disappointed?

I would have to say God has been disappointed with all men except Christ. Which is why HE came.

In relation to this situation. It is entirely possible that Kurt is a fraud and getting his just reward, but it is also possible that Kurt is operating within the will of God. The results of an undertaking don't neccesarily show if it's in or out of God's will.

Especially in the New Testament. The apostles had severe repercussions, as did the early church. If God was with them why would they be allowed to suffer so much or be killed?

My point is going off of circumstantial evidence of the results of the trials and imprisonment cannot be used for evidence as too guilt in the eyes of God. As much as I don't like it, God throughout history doesn't deliver the innocent very often. We have a couple examples in the old testament, but thousands of the new with the subjects being beaten, jailed, killed, abused, you name it. God's deliverance isn't a sign of guilt or innocence.

Good to have an honest answer and conversation.... After all we are all bystanders and expressing our opinions. Nobody really knows. Except N.D.?!!!?

dr. ira gilac said...

Consequences

The housing crisis
hits home


The "new" economy
The human face of the credit debacle.

Homeless camps are starting to fill up with employed people.

They couldn't keep up with the their mortgage payments so they lost their homes. This story is repeating all over America.


www.brasschecktv.com/page/
289.html

ethel said...

ND,

Stick to bilge reporting and examining what you call bilge. You have become the bilge expert and we know we can count on you to deliver a thorough commentary of bilge.

You obviously don't want to see the truth. Read the newspapers retard. There's bilge. What happened with Bear Stearns? How about Countrywide? How many of the states in the union are underfunded by billions of dollars for pensions? You're an idiot. This country is using a broken money system and the side effects are EVERYWHERE. Keeping your nose in the bilge and don't pay attention to reality. Keep thinking that court opinions and law PRACTICE define truth. There is more debt owed by our country than could ever be repaid. Our country has an open line of credit spending billions of dollars we don't have every month. Where does that money come from????

dr. ira gilac said...

They couldn't keep up with the their mortgage payments so they lost their homes. This story is repeating all over America.






whatever you do, dont come here to this blaaaaahg...


you wont get any pite here.....


IF you lost you dam house, its YOU fault! dont bleem the banks.

just axe judge beens, or capt. nemo, fruit of the vinlands, etx.......



just shut up and pitch you tent like everynone else.

and rember, NO fires of any tipe inside you tent to make coffee, or heat you food.

just get some tin foil and put it on the gound and put you food in it. let the sun heat it up.

and then be ecolgical too, when you done cooking and eatying you food, then take you tin fool, and wrap fool around you head. now you also protected from sunspits too!

or in case some nother homless try to p on you head while you slepping.

dr. ira gilac said...

heres one for you deep thinkers....



what is the meaning of the verses in the bible that say:



"there will be many in that Day, who will come and say...'Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your Name?...have we not cast out demons in Your Name?' "


and He will tell them...

"depart from me, I never knew ye...ye workers of inqiquity.."



NOW...is not prophesying in Jesus Name doing good?


Certainly casting out demons in Jesus Name and curing people in His name is doing good, no???

certainly, if Jesus gave you power to heal someone, or cast out demons, and in His name to boot, you are doing good?

but, obviously not.

this is a big problem. so if you can prophesy, or cast out demons, or walk in a hospital and cure everyone there, youve got the "key" to heaven, right?

so why, even those doing these good deeds, will Jesus tell to "depart from Me, I never knew ye"


i mean if healing and propesying and casting demons etc. doesnt guarantee that youre in, then what does?

if that doesnt get you in, then what about those who cannot even do these things, then they have no shot at all??

hmmmmmmmm?????????????



??????????????????????????

dr. ira gilac said...

MATT 7:21-23

neodemes said...

Ethel said...

"The word "want" came from you, so I am not going to define it."



Ah, but it came from you, or I wouldn't have asked for a definition.

Review your statement:

"OK,

If HE doesn't want something to happen does it happen?"

As for the rest of your post, I don't have an issue, other than to point out the dichotomy created by your statement:

"God's will is that all should come to repentance and that none should perish, but attain everlasting life through Christ.

However, many don't."

Of course, this is a quandary that has been debated since Calvin and Arminius (and probably before)...if God is Sovereign and "wills" all to repentance and salvation, how is it that not all are saved?

I don't expect to hear a satisfactory answer in this world.

As far as this blog is concerned, the question is, is Kurt sheep or goat; wheat or tare?

The answer is between Kurt and God; we have our own relationship with God to develop.

ethel said...

Neo,

Originally the word "want" came from your response to my first post. Either way it's not relevant now.

Fair enough answer. I agree with your summation. It's also why I felt compelled to ask you those questions. We really don't and probably won't know the answers.

New topic....

In your opinion has the banking industry in general achieved a degree of control in our political system?

I believe that the banking industry is AT LEAST as guilty as the tobacco industry of enhancing their "product" to make it more addictive and dangerous, and that the long term effects are cancerous.

Your opinion on those 2 statements please.

neodemes said...

Ethel asks:

"In your opinion has the banking industry in general achieved a degree of control in our political system?"

Sure it has.

Anything having anything to do with money, corrupts.

The love of money is the root of all evil.

But, the American people are equally culpable.

The overwhelming desire for immediate gratification has led to the creation of a debt-driven economy. Without the participation of the masses, there would not be a banking system operating under the mechanisms such as exists today.

I do not, though, believe for a moment the foolish argument that folks who borrow money to buy a home were cheated because of the BS line of crap that tries to convince the mentally challenged that their promissory note, of itself, paid their debt.

Want to be debt free?

Pay cash.

neodemes said...

Regarding:

Matthew 7:

21Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

22Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.


What is the criteria, in this context, for entering into the Kingdom?

he that doeth the will of my Father

What is the Father's will?

John 6:

28Then said they unto him, What shall we do, that we might work the works of God?

29Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.


The primary requirement for salvation is exceedingly simply; believe that Jesus Christ is Lord and Savior.

Before those of you works based theologians protest that works are required, and that the previous verses spoke of doing works, see vs. 38-40:

38For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.

39And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.

40And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.


Works do have their place in the life of the believer, but they have nothing to do with entering the Kingdom.

Our works will have a variety of motives and, these will be reviewed at the Judgment Seat of Christ. Many works which we deemed worthy will amount to nothing. The rest (if any) will warrant a "Well done".

We could get into a discussion of Crowns, and all, which we will throw at the feet of the Lord.

Personally, I'll be happy to hear that "Well done".

dr. ira gilac said...

What is the criteria, in this context, for entering into the Kingdom?

he that doeth the will of my Father in Heaven.




so, then altho healing others and casting demons appears to be doing good deeds, then this may not be the will of the Fahter in heaven, even tho it appears good.


BUT, then conversely, those who may "appear" to be doing evil, may actually be doing the Fathers will. it only "appears" evil to people, because they do not know the Fathers will.



then...

can doing the Fathers will ever be evil??

NO. altho it may appear that way to the world.


does the Father ever ask to do evil.

NO.


the Father cannot be tempted to do evil, nor can He tempt others to do evil.



extreme example.

could 9/11 somehow have been the Fathers will, evil as it may have seemed?

YES.

was it?

i dont know, god did not tell me personally.

do i personally judge it to be evil? (at this point in time)

yes, but i am not god.


if i use ROM 8:28, then 9/11 was a good event.

"for we know that ALL things, must work for good, for our salvation, to those who love HIM and are called according to His purpose"

looked at that way, 9/11 was not an evil event.


personally, i find it hard to accept, but can only find good in it by looking at it this way.


suppose 9/11 was stopped, and the evil ptb raised the stakes and created a nyoocyoolar evnet and even more died. then 9/11 saved lives. it a perverted way to look at it, but then again i am not god.

neodemes said...

"BUT, then conversely, those who may "appear" to be doing evil, may actually be doing the Fathers will."

And the scriptural basis for this is where?

'All things working together for good' isn't the answer.

dr. ira gilac said...

"BUT, then conversely, those who may "appear" to be doing evil, may actually be doing the Fathers will."



you missed the key word "appear"


just becasue something or event "appears" evil to you, doesnt mean that it is judged as evil by god.


and 8:28 does apply, becasue it means that as all works for good, something that YOU personally judge as evil, may in fact not be evil. only god can truly judge evil, even tho the bible tells christians to do so.

just becasue the bible tells us to judge evil, does not mean that we are infallible.

therefore some evetns that we judge as evil, may in fact be gods will.

dr. ira gilac said...

so therefore, if you incorrectly judge someone as doing evil, as you are not god, they may in fact be doing gods will...unless god has told you personally about a certain event(s) or people who are truly doing evil and not gods will.


god hasnt told me thse things lately, but i wont be presumtious and say that He is not telling you about it.

dr. ira gilac said...

And the scriptural basis for this is where?


in summary:

there is no scriptural basis for it. you have to make inferences, like you dont know gods will. so you cannot perfectly judge correctly what an good event is form an evil one.



there is no scriptual basis telling you not to sell drugs either. you have to make inferences.


the law is writtne on your heart, rember?

dr. ira gilac said...

wheres SOP??????

notorial dissent said...

and Ethel finally comes to a point besides the one on her head
What happened with Bear Stearns? How about Countrywide? How many of the states in the union are underfunded by billions of dollars for pensions?

It is called greed and stupidity, similar to as was practiced by dim and dimmer. When you make loans to people who can’t afford to pay them back and then follow that up with stupid business decisions you end up where Bear and CW are today. No grand conspiracy, no great plot, just the same old arrogant stupidity that has been bringing down business since the dawn of time. It wouldn’t matter what we were using for money if the above scenario is played out, as it produces the same results every time. I know I am whjistling to the wind here, but you might try actually reading some of the history of your country, and then pay particular attention to the assorted depressions that happened from 1800 through 1900 when we were on a bi-metallic, freely coined currency. To put it in terms simple enough for you an Moogey to comprehend, money was coined from all the precious metal the govt could get their hands on at a specific rate, and the money was worth what the gov’t said it was by statute. There is no magic in gold, silver, or paper, only in what it can or cannot buy.

As to your remark about pensions, that too can be laid to greed, and the attitude of most gov’ts that they will put off til tomorrow what they don’t want to face today, and again you have no point.

As to “Where does that money come from????” The same place it always has, our economy and in this day and age, the world’s economy. As to the debt, so what? As long as it is managed it is a fact of life, and has nothing to do with what you want to rant about.

Ethel asks: Nemo
"In your opinion has the banking industry in general achieved a degree of control in our political system?"

To which he has replied: “Sure it has.” And to which I add, about which the same can be said of almost every other big industry in the nation. Again no point.

and Ethel comes forth with another nugget
The overwhelming desire for immediate gratification has led to the creation of a debt-driven economy. Without the participation of the masses, there would not be a banking system operating under the mechanisms such as exists today.

Nonsense. Banking has been in existence since man discovered something more important than rocks to trade for what he needed. Without banking in some form we would have no economy at all, and would in fact still be trading rocks for rocks and starving to death.

one last Ethel nugget
BUT, then conversely, those who may "appear" to be doing evil, may actually be doing the Fathers will."

By all means, please point out the commandment that says: thou shalt lie and steal and commit fraud in my name, or file fraudulent documents and makes false statements? I really would like to see that one since all my copies of the bible seem to curiously deficient of those bits.

When a thing smells of sulphur and brimstone, it is generally for a good reason.

neodemes said...

Dr. SOP - Consider:

Genesis 3:
5For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.

Genesis 3:
22And the LORD God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil

neodemes said...

ND said...

and Ethel comes forth with another nugget

The overwhelming desire for immediate gratification has led to the creation of a debt-driven economy. Without the participation of the masses, there would not be a banking system operating under the mechanisms such as exists today.


Nonsense. Banking has been in existence since man discovered something more important than rocks to trade for what he needed. Without banking in some form we would have no economy at all, and would in fact still be trading rocks for rocks and starving to death.

********************************

Hold on there, pardner.

That there nugget was mine and you are misconstruing the intent...banking would exist, but the mechanics would be different if the people that drive it (use it), were using it wisely.

Proverbs 22:

7The rich ruleth over the poor, and the borrower is servant to the lender.

dr. ira gilac said...

Dr. SOP - Consider:

Genesis 3:
5For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.

Genesis 3:
22And the LORD God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil


above from OT.



FROM NT:'


"do not judge, lest ye be judged"


so, if you incorrectly judge, (condemn) someone as dong evil, then IF you make a mistake, THEN you will suffer judgement yourself.

and obviously, the NT supersedes the OT.


EXAMPLE: you are critical of the dg. then as a christian, if i judge waht you do as evil. thus, on my judgement, you are evil. thus you certanly cannot be doing gods will. case closed.

see, it doesnt work that way. i wont judge you as i dont want to be subject to gods judgement.

thus, on the same shekel, neither can anyone here condemn the dg either, lest they bring themselves to condemnation should they be wrong.


and yes, i will have to admit that even some of the evil bankers could have been doing gods will.

and certainly, the dg may be doing the same.

and seriously, some of you tread on very, very thin ice.

some of you lambaste k, even if jokingly, and dont mean it. if k is doing gods will, and he claims a relationship to christ, then you are in effect saying that he is working for satan.

and even if personally, you dont like k.

sometime ago, someone here was criticised as being very harsh. i cannot imagine anyone more harsh than those who are lambasting one who claims a relationship to christ. these who think they do gods work....with these, who needs non christian persecutors??? or even the ac? wehn your own (supposed) will curse you.

you may not realize it, but you are effectively blaspheming the Holy Spirit.

and you all know the penalty for blaspheming the Holy Spirit.

verrrry, verrrrry dangerous territory.


verrrry dangerous territory indeed......

dr. ira gilac said...

for clarification:


you may not realize it, but you are effectively blaspheming the Holy Spirit.

and you all know the penalty for blaspheming the Holy Spirit.

verrrry, verrrrry dangerous territory.


verrrry dangerous territory indeed......


effectivel blaspheming the HS when you say that k is not doing gods will, thus k is doing satans will, but k claims that he has a relationship to christ.


rember, what you do shall be done to you someday.

someday someone will claim that you do satans will wehn you say that you arent.


have you ever thought how that would make you feel???


do you ever stop to think how you make k feel when you write like this to one who claims a relationship to christ??

it would break your heart.


and this i guarentee you.

you are not pleasing christ. ****whatsoever****.

and you know what they say about "what goes around..."

you better hope that christ didnt make a little note about you in his pocketsize notebook...

dr. ira gilac said...

now on to nother subjec:




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neodemes said...

The Bible does, indeed, speak about judging and being judged.

It also says:

1 Corinthians 6

1Dare any of you, having a matter against another, go to law before the unjust, and not before the saints?

2Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters?

3Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life?

4If then ye have judgments of things pertaining to this life, set them to judge who are least esteemed in the church.


Is Kurt a prophet of God, doing His ordained work?

Possible, but, to date, there is no evidence to show that.

Is Kurt a bald-faced, lying scam artist?

Possible, and, so far he has drawn a 'Do Not Pass Go' card for his efforts.

Is Kurt a deluded, narcissistic, well-meaning but lost-in-the-brush fool?

Also possible.

Does every utterance of 'retard' that falls from his 'pen' scream out 'I am a Christian and I do not judge my brothers in Christ!'.

Not to my ears, er, eyes.

Is the storm of paper he sent flying in all directions totally without sense or merit?

Yeap.

notorial dissent said...

Neo, my apologies, I misread the statement, and I do agree with the sentiment, I just don't think it is terribly likely.

There is a lot wrong with the banking industry, and the same can be said for most of modern business unfortunately.

dr. ira gilac said...

1Dare any of you, having a matter against another, go to law before the unjust, and not before the saints?


DO YOU HAVE A MATTER AGAISNT K, PERSONALLY? YOU ENTERED THE DG PROGRAM YOURSLEF?

2Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters?


"SHALL JUDGE..."

IE., NOT YET.

3Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life?

SEE ABOVE.

4If then ye have judgments of things pertaining to this life, set them to judge who are least esteemed in the church.

WHEN/WHO CALLED YOU TO JUDGE THE DG PROGRAM? HAVE YOU PERSONALLY BEEN SCAMMED BY IT?

IF NOT, YOU COULD BE CALLED A "BUSYBODY" MINDING OTHERS AFFAIRS.

BUSYBODYS ARE NOT IN FAVOR WITH CHRIST ACCORDING TO THE BIBLE.



THE POINT IS, IS THAT IF YOU ARE GOING TO JUDGE, THEN IF ONLY ONE OTHER WHO CALLS HIMSELF A CHRISTIAN CAN JUDGE YOU, THEN MANY HERE HAVE CONDEMNED WHAT YOU HAVE SAID/DONE.

SO YOU ARE AT A STANDOFF, WITH ALL AWAITING THE FINAL JUDGEMENT. SO YOU PREJUDGING CARRIES NO WEIGHT AT THIS TIME.

YOU ARE TRYING TO CONDUCT A HEARING BEFORE THE REAL TRIAL.

neodemes said...

NP, ND.

:-)

neodemes said...

"WHEN/WHO CALLED YOU TO JUDGE THE DG PROGRAM?"

They did, SOP, the minute they spammed my forum with their BS advertising a 100% proven, moral and ethical process to eliminate mortgages.

As was evident at the time and is still obvious today, it was/is none of the above.

Thanks for asking.

mogel007 said...

Notarial Dissent said: "No one ever said the clients were committing fraud against themselves, they WERE committing fraud by letting Kurt issue the false releases,"
_______________________________

The problem with your statement is that the banks WEREN'T in reality the victims of the alleged scam or conspiracy according to the court record, because all bank fraud charges were dropped, because the prosecution KNEW THEY COULDN'T PROVE THEM & NEVER INTENDED TO PROVE THEM FROM THE VERY BEGINNING & the banks never came to testify or prove that they were financially harmed by these documents the dorean group filed, & the financial institutions never proved they had any financial damages nor did they list, tally or validate them. No harm, no financial damages, no real foul, no jail time.

The financial institutions never even proved they gave a loan or were the holder in due course of those loans. The alleged victims (financial institutions) never produced the proper paper trail of validation. Notarial Dissent, by your own admissions, a recorded document isn't proof or validation of anything because the documents could be a forgery.
The financial institutions claims in essence therefore can be a forgery or a scam itself.

The prosecution changed the victim during the trial from the financial institutions to the dorean clients only to confuse and prejudice the petite jury. Had the jury been educated with better & proper legal & real jury instructions by Judge Alsup, they would have never convicted the Dorean Group, so the guilty verdicts need to be overturned & will be in an appellate or higher court due to the defects during the trial.

Had the prosecution never alleged bank fraud to the grand jury, they would have never had the jurisdictional hook to even hear the case, in Federal Court & get a grand jury indictment. In that scenario, of no bank fraud, there is no Federal court jurisdiction either to try them & judge whether the Dorean Group were guilty of fraud.

Mail fraud is a specific fraud towards financial institutions & a fraud against property rights that didn't apply to the Dorean case. What property rights did the Dorean Group transgress against Dorean clients since they were made out to be the victims. The answer is none!!!!


We all remember that the State of North Carolina & the Attorney General there, stopped the Dorean Group from doing business in that State. The Attorney General in theory was representing the interests of the Dorean clients when he filed an injunction against the Dorean Group to do business there. The State was not representing the banks interests. The Federal Courts represent the banks interests, but they pretended they had the authority to protect the dorean clients interests which is part of their deception. The Dorean Group were not convicted of crimes in any State, since the State of Utah dropped their phony charges. That's why federal charges had to be logged, but they were lodged incorrectly when they alleged bank fraud to get jurisdiction, & than changed & dropped the alleged bank fraud charges, & by doing so, lost any possible jurisdiction they may have had.

The Petite Jury didn't quite understood what happened or the strategy behind the prosecution's illegal and improper manuevers of changing the original indicments, otherwise, the petite jury would have never voted the guilty verdicts they did.

neodemes said...

Hey Byron, if you are so cock-sure the DG did nothing illegal, why don't you take over where they left off??

Surely you have enough of the presentment package documented, and you are clearly an expert on the subject matter - go get 'em.

Let me know how that works out for you.

notorial dissent said...

and Moogie strikes again by trying to twist one unrelated statement into an unsupported misstatement about another one
The problem with your statement is that the banks WEREN'T in reality the victims of the alleged scam or conspiracy according to the court record, because all bank fraud charges were dropped,

Other than having nothing to do with the original statement, the first victims of the fraud were the clients, followed by the lenders. HOWEVER, the bank fraud charges were dismissed-without prejudice, not dropped. They had sufficient grounds and proof on mail fraud which is a Federal Crime that carries more time and that is the one they went for. As to your contention about not being able to prove fraud, you had best speak to the N C court of appeals which has upheld a lower court’s determination that the Dorean releases were fraudulent documents which pretty well puts paid to your claims of innocence and lack of ability to prove the other fraud charges. Again, since the charges were mail fraud there was no necessity for anyone to testify except the people who did. Otherwise, more wishful thinking on your part. It still boils down to the fact that the dim duo had no legal authority to sign anything relating to the mortgages, and therefore filing any document relating to them constituted provable fraud, and it was so proven.

Moogie tries and old refrain, still sour
The prosecution changed the victim during the trial from the financial institutions to the dorean clients only to confuse and prejudice the petite jury.

Uh, no, since the financial institutions were never an issue at trial that statement is pure nonsense, and neither were the Dorean clients brought in to the matter. The charges were using the mails to file fraudulent documents.

and again
Had the prosecution never alleged bank fraud to the grand jury, they would have never had the jurisdictional hook to even hear the case, in Federal Court & get a grand jury indictment. In that scenario, of no bank fraud, there is no Federal court jurisdiction either to try them & judge whether the Dorean Group were guilty of fraud.

Wrong again, the bank fraud was only one of the charges brought, the mail charges could, and did stand alone as Federal charges, using the mails to file fraudulent documents was all the “hook” as you put it, they needed. And they were guilty of committing mail fraud.

and still can’t read
Mail fraud is a specific fraud towards financial institutions & a fraud against property rights that didn't apply to the Dorean case.

Wrong again, mail fraud is using the mails to commit fraud, any kind of fraud, so try again.


and still hasn’t a clue
The Attorney General in theory was representing the interests of the Dorean clients when he filed an injunction against the Dorean Group to do business there.

You really are unclear on the subject aren’t you. The NC AG filed a cease and desist because Dorean was breaking the law and they weren’t going to let them proceed. And he was acting on behalf of the state of N Carolina. If more state’s AG’s had taken proactive action this wouldn’t have been the mess it turned into.

You are delusional. The Federal court acted on behalf of the govt in the interest of dealing with someone who had used the US Mail to commit fraud. They were not acting in the behalf of anyone, they were dealing with violations of Federal law.

still keeps telling himself it will all go away
The Dorean Group were not convicted of crimes in any State, since the State of Utah dropped their phony charges.

I wouldn’t hold my breath here Moogs, NC has declared the Dorean paper a fraud, and may go ahead and prosecute, and IL is also considering prosecution for some cases, so don’t bet on it.

and still doesn’t have a clue about how criminal procedure works
The Petite Jury didn't quite understood what happened or the strategy behind the prosecution's illegal and improper manuevers of changing the original indicments, otherwise, the petite jury would have never voted the guilty verdicts they did.

Right Moogs, they understood well enough that mail frauds had been brought and that sufficient proof had been presented, and they convicted.

Just keep telling yourself this, it won’t do any good, but you can keep deluding yourself as long as you want, still won’t change anything. They’ve still been convicted, are on their way to their separate prisons and cells, there ever more to remain.

Scott from Vineland said...

ND said...
I will leave you with one final thought, if Daddy came home from the war minus his equipment, would you have the balls to make the same stupid statement you did previously?
___________________________________
I find this apples and oranges argument unconvincing, Mr. Dissent. I can see that we are clearly on different pages in terms of what I consider to be morality issues; so be it. But if you think for a minute that Daddy losing his junk to a grenade or land mine is in ANY way comparable to a gender-confused mommy who wants to be a daddy, then you're not as intellectually honest as I have always believed.

Sorry to everyone else to have gotten so far off topic for so long but I find this whole concept offensive and after all, I WAS called out on it. I will speak no more forever of penicularly-challenged pregnant "men". ND, can we agree to call each idiots on this specific subject and let it go at that? I'm sure we both have better things to do than bicker like an old married trans-gendered couple.

Scott from Vineland said...

Hey Happy Jack, long time. How've you been?

HJ, I have a question. You made a comment some time ago about Kurt's brother and it still has me wondering... do you actually know him or is your knowledge of him based on your conversations with Kurt himself? I'm a bit reluctant to bring this up because I really didn't want to drag Kurt's family into this forum but I do think about them a lot. If you don't want to discuss this here, you can PM me at quatloos or on neo's forum:

http://www.rei-resource.com/forum/

Later,
sss