Wednesday, September 02, 2009

Being Yourself (7-19-09)

I was reading the scriptures at I Chronicles 12. This is not one of the most moving blocks of scripture yet God used it to give me a sweet revelation. In the height of God's supernatural faith being imparted as a gift that can get you through any circumstance is this lingering person called yourself. Many times you seem to be a spectator to your own life. I was kind of in this place where my flesh is weary while my spirit is strong. In this scripture God chronicles the names of men who joined David in the wilderness. It lists some of their exploits as warriors but doesn't say anything of their prayer life, love, compassion, or any spiritual gift. I think the devil tries to beat us over the head with the ordinariness of our lives. Most of us are not healing the sick, moving mountains, or calling fire down from heaven. This band of men were skilled in war but that is a human exercise. This is a very flattering version of their alliance to David. In other text they are ready to kill him when raiders took their wives and children. They were loyal but with all the frailties of humanity. The one thing that stands out as a spiritual choice is that they aligned themselves with the word of God. Samuel spoke of David being King and these men chose to believe it and stake their lives on it before God made it obvious to the masses. They were men of flesh, ordinary in circumstance except for this one choice. They did obtain extraordinary victories over time in the ordinary course of being themselves only because they believed God's word true. If you like them can make that choice before it is made obvious that is a supernatural miracle. No greater miracle is needed in the ordinary life for this revelation is the gateway to endless possibilities in Christ. What you need when you need it to get to where God wants you is easy compared with the revelation steering you to choose God's way through his unrevealed King. Be yourself as God chose you when you arrived in the wilderness surrounded by a ragtag band. Victories and vindication will be ordinary to you.

128 comments:

mogel007 said...

Defending Against Foreclosure

There are many defenses against the lender. Here are a few:

1. The lender failed to state a claim upon which relief may be granted. Lenders are not injured because they loaned no money & haven't ever validated the debt. The lender didn't even give the borrower a receipt for the promissory note deposit. The lender needs to deposit the damaged amount into the court in order for them to be a Plaintiff. They haven't done that, so the lender is not injured. The Plaintiff has given up the rights of this case tot he court. If there is no controversy, the claim needs to be dismissed.

2. The lender was paid by the insurance company on clients default so the lender can't be paid again through the court's cooperation by allowance of the lenders foreclosure on the property & the lender selling the home for double compensation. This is like a Plaintiff filing a claim in court against a tenant for negligence due to his house burning down & also the landlord admitting he received compensation from the insurance company for this sad event. The judge wouldn't or shouldn't allow the claim against the tenant to go to judgment. It's unjust enrichment to the Plaintiff if this is allowed.

3. Often the Plaintiff is a Trust Company foreclosing on the property & the trust company isn't legally registered as a Trust. Trust is not even a legal or registered entity, so they have no standing to sue. They are not registerd with the Secretary of the State. Demand copies of this registration to be provided to the court. They can't produce them. They aren't a legal person under the law to sue. The Courts recognize this if you bring up this issue.

4. In the trust agreement, the trust does not give any power to the trustee to sue the borrower, so they are not acting with authority anyway.

5. Promissory note has to be assigned from the Trust to the trustee & the trustee has to produce the original note. Most of the time this isn't done. The problem is that the trustee doesn't even have proper legal assignment. Demand proof of paperwork of all of this, or motion to dismiss the foreclosure action. If the lenders foreclosing doesn't have all of his paperwork in order, he loses if you demand that he produce everything.

mogel007 said...

A 1099A form is proof of an escrow account that has been abandoned. The sorry truth is that the lender files an abandonment of funds when the note is paid off. The abandonment of funds is all the mortgage payments that were put in escrow for the creditor's behalf, & that is you, the alleged borrower, who is really the creditor in the loan transaction.

With the abandonment form filed, the lender gets to keep all of those mortgage payments that you have made over all those years, just like if you have a checking account & it becomes dormant for so many years due to non-use, any monies in the account, end up going to the State & you legally lose them & lose your claim to them after so much time if you don't make a claim. When a lender makes a claim, it is assumed it is valid. LOL

You can delay a foreclosure by filing a counter claim. Then the lender has to hire ANOTHER LAWYER, just to defend your counter claim.

Here's the real kicker. The lender reports to the IRS that THEY PAID INCOME TO YOU, so the lender doesn't have to pay taxes on all that income they receive from all of those mortgage payments that you made to the lender.

The proof of the lending fraud is this: The lender reported to the IRS, that you RECEIVED INCOME. But as the borrower, you never got the income or the income from the mortgage payments you paid the lender.

What is the Dorean Group remedy in Phase 1? One of the papers to file is a 1040 X return to the IRS. The IRS pays you back the value that you claim you are legally entitled to, that's the remedy.

Through an amended return, you can recoup money from the IRS, going 3 years back. The IRS is 4 months behind in processing amended returns.

A 1099 (OID) reports the funds that were brought into circulation by the borrower. Remember when a loan is given, NEW FUNDS ARE BROUGHT INTO CIRCULATION or as it says in Federal Reserve publications, "their assets & liabilities both increase" when a loan is given. These are monies that are created, not borrowed from the lender.

You can 1099 OID (original issued document), the following things:

(1) promissory notes or credit card limits

(2) Value of all checks written

(3) Original amount borrowed

(4) Mortgage interest paid.

The IRS is 2 years behind in processing the 1099 OID's.

How do we know this remedy works? Personal testimonies of people that have received monies from the IRS.

How do we know that Jesus is the Christ, the son of God? Personal testimonies of credible men & woman throughout history, even before the physical birth of Christ. It has nothing to do with when the Bible was written. The dates when the Bible was written or translated or compiled is irrelevant since Jesus existed as a premortal Spirit long before the earthly world existed. Jesus's beginnings didn't start with a myth started by the Church or by evil men that were only interested in some sort of control over the people's thinking & living.

mogel007 said...

Another way to defend against foreclosure is hiring a TILA company that performs an audit on your mortgage. After you give them all of your paperwork, they will perform a forensic audit showing all of the violations the lender has committed. There are always violations found. Generally those violations can amount to $2,000 per violation. The company than puts the lender on notice of all of those violations. A counter claim for all of those damages due to the violations can be filed to bring the lender to the negotiating table in the form of causing the stopping of the foreclosure action or reduced indebtedness owed by the borrower.

I believe NACA will help someone with this for free:

www.naca.com

Or there are companies out there that will do this for you for a fee. One company that does this is for a fee upfront is:
www.tila2.com

You are in a better negotiating position to get a loan modification to get lower payments or principal reduced if you have filed a TILA claim in court against your lender or have threatened to do so.

mogel007 said...

When the Dorean Group was in business, the sad truth is that the lenders were more apt to foreclose on dorean clients, and many lenders did.

Now the environment has changed & lenders are often willing to work out payment arrangements with clients. All you have to do is show a hardship, like a loss of job, loss of income, death, injury, etc. and than you under consideration for lower monthly payments, lowered principal, or lower interest or having all back payments put into the back side of the loan. I believe in some cases, you can lower your interest rate as low as 2%. You still have to show that you can afford the new monthly payments or the loan modification isn't going to be approved.

Lenders now seem to put people on a hardship circumstance under a 3 month trial payment plan where you have to make those 3 months of lowered payments before they will put you on a permanent loan modification. Course you have to provide all of your current financial information to the lender & ask for a loan modification to be considered. Maybe only about 5% are approved for a permanent loan modification which is the sad thing, so Obama's plan on this really isn't working as expected. That's why going the TILA challenge route first is probably best.

sopsback said...

You can 1099 OID (original issued document),

CORRECTION:

OID - original issue discount, as in like a bond sold at a discount to face value


while the OID process is indeed valid, according to TNPS kennedy, they have stopped processing these documents and those whose have been processed are being "tested" on their knowledge of sov'ty/commerce

meaning that just filing the oid's is not just a "file and forget" process.

the irs will come after you and if you dont know what you are doing, you will get very hurt or wind up in a iron cubicle...illegaly of course, but there nonetheless.

and i wouldnt hire a tila lawyer either, they will take yor money and run...i can vouch for that.


and unless naca has changeed much, they were a paper tiger a couple of years ago...all talk and then try to get them to act for you???? nada thing.

sopsback said...

meaning that just filing the oid's is not just a "file and forget" process.

the irs will come after you and if you dont know what you are doing, you will get very hurt or wind up in a iron cubicle...illegaly of course, but there nonetheless.


unless the process is being recognized offically and streamlined for mass consumption to the public, then one who does this had better know theri rights OUTSIDE of commerce, meaning when they get irs letters they had better know what to do with them and know the UCC process like the back of their hand.

if they have to depend on a layer for help, their goose is cocked. its too late to cry uncle.

of course, as we speak, they are developing the DTC process. depostory trust corp. where you can access the treausy acct. based on your birth cert/etc

but like the dg, these processes are undergoing constant change/revision as they go along.

mogel007 said...

and i wouldnt hire a tila lawyer either, they will take yor money and run...i can vouch for that.
________________________________

THE REAL QUESTION IS THOUGH, DID YOUR ATTORNEY DO A FORENSIC AUDIT & FILE TILA VIOLATIONS. I DOUBT IT.

sopsback said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
sopsback said...

September 3, 2009

China Shocks West With Threat Push US-EU Into “Dustbin Of History”

By: Sorcha Faal, and as reported to her Western Subscribers

Russian trade ministry officials are reporting to Prime Minister Putin today that China is preparing to plunge the United States and European Union into the “dustbin of history” as major World economic powers over their, the West’s, deliberate collapsing of the present Global economic system in order to install their long sought after New World Order.

China’s intent to carry out on their threat, these reports say, began this past week when, as perhaps best stated by one American financial analyst, China told the West to go “straight to hell” when the Chinese stated they would deliberately default on Trillions-of dollars in US backed debt security instruments called OTC because they were fraudulently created by Western bankers and as such are now considered an “act of war”.

To the ability of the United States to defend itself against China, the likelihood of their success appears grim as their April, 2009 economic “war game” clearly shows, and as we can read:

“The Pentagon sponsored a first-of-its-kind war game last month focused not on bullets and bombs — but on how hostile nations might seek to cripple the U.S. economy, a scenario made all the more real by the global financial crisis.

The two-day event near Ft. Meade, Maryland, had all the earmarks of a regular war game. Participants sat along a V-shaped set of desks beneath an enormous wall of video monitors displaying economic data, according to the accounts of three participants.

“It felt a little bit like Dr. Strangelove,” one person who was at the previously undisclosed exercise told POLITICO.

But instead of military brass plotting America’s defense, it was hedge-fund managers, professors and executives from at least one investment bank, UBS – all invited by the Pentagon to play out global scenarios that could shift the balance of power between the world’s leading economies.

Their efforts were carefully observed and recorded by uniformed military officers and members of the U.S. intelligence community.

In the end, there was sobering news for the United States – the savviest economic warrior proved to be China, a growing economic power that strengthened its position the most over the course of the war-game.”

Even worse, as the American people are presently “enduring the sharpest decline in their private-sector income in at least 50 years and their longest period of income stagnation since the nation’s bicentennial in 1976”, new reports are showing that for the first time in modern history the wealth of the West has been concentrated in the hands of just a few, and as we can read:

“A recent analysis of the 2007 financial markets of 48 countries has revealed that the world's finances are in the hands of just a few mutual funds, banks, and corporations. This is the first clear picture of the global concentration of financial power, and point out the worldwide financial system's vulnerability as it stood on the brink of the current economic crisis.

sopsback said...

A pair of physicists at the Swiss Federal Institute of Technology in Zurich did a physics-based analysis of the world economy as it looked in early 2007. Stefano Battiston and James Glattfelder extracted the information from the tangled yarn that links 24,877 stocks and 106,141 shareholding entities in 48 countries, revealing what they called the "backbone" of each country's financial market. These backbones represented the owners of 80 percent of a country's market capital, yet consisted of remarkably few shareholders.”

And to the largest component of this wealth called derivatives owned by these Westerners, now called a “Time Bomb”, and with China’s actions against the West, this “house of cards” is set to explode with a force having no equal in history, and as we can further read:

“What are derivatives? Some investors describe them as "dormant economic weapons of mass destruction". They essentially are large leveraged bets on top of stocks, bonds and commodities. Money can be made within months or seconds by betting if a stock will go up, down or even remain the same. With no credit rating you can place a bet worth double your account balance. Big time investors get greater leverage with these instantaneous loans.

The New York Times, Oct 8th 2008: “The derivatives market is $531 trillion, up from $106 trillion in 2002″. This market is setup with odds similar to a racetrack. Trillions are won and lost (transferred) every second. But unlike a racetrack the big players have ultimate control. Their trillions can make stocks move. A 4% up swing in a stock can cause a derivative bet to rise more than 100% in value or vice versa. A low performing stock that rises only 6% a year could actually have many 3, 6 or 9 percent swings weekly or monthly (some stocks daily). There are billions to be made over and over again by the people that control billions and trillions thus the markets. A grand game approved by the top.

The globe's GDP is at $60.1 trillion. The globe's total financial assets were reported as $167 trillion in 2006. A few trillion lower today no doubt. The highly volatile derivatives market is worth noting because it dwarfs the entire world’s GDP and total financial assets combined.”

Equally chilling for the West is China’s ability to destroy the United States and European Union economies from being able to re-start their economies based on new green technologies that are wholly dependent upon rare Earth minerals, and as we can read:

“China is set to tighten its hammerlock on the market for some of the world’s most obscure but valuable minerals.

China currently accounts for 93 percent of production of so-called rare earth elements — and more than 99 percent of the output for two of these elements, vital for a wide range of green energy technologies and military applications like missiles.

sopsback said...

A pair of physicists at the Swiss Federal Institute of Technology in Zurich did a physics-based analysis of the world economy as it looked in early 2007. Stefano Battiston and James Glattfelder extracted the information from the tangled yarn that links 24,877 stocks and 106,141 shareholding entities in 48 countries, revealing what they called the "backbone" of each country's financial market. These backbones represented the owners of 80 percent of a country's market capital, yet consisted of remarkably few shareholders.”

And to the largest component of this wealth called derivatives owned by these Westerners, now called a “Time Bomb”, and with China’s actions against the West, this “house of cards” is set to explode with a force having no equal in history, and as we can further read:

“What are derivatives? Some investors describe them as "dormant economic weapons of mass destruction". They essentially are large leveraged bets on top of stocks, bonds and commodities. Money can be made within months or seconds by betting if a stock will go up, down or even remain the same. With no credit rating you can place a bet worth double your account balance. Big time investors get greater leverage with these instantaneous loans.

The New York Times, Oct 8th 2008: “The derivatives market is $531 trillion, up from $106 trillion in 2002″. This market is setup with odds similar to a racetrack. Trillions are won and lost (transferred) every second. But unlike a racetrack the big players have ultimate control. Their trillions can make stocks move. A 4% up swing in a stock can cause a derivative bet to rise more than 100% in value or vice versa. A low performing stock that rises only 6% a year could actually have many 3, 6 or 9 percent swings weekly or monthly (some stocks daily). There are billions to be made over and over again by the people that control billions and trillions thus the markets. A grand game approved by the top.

The globe's GDP is at $60.1 trillion. The globe's total financial assets were reported as $167 trillion in 2006. A few trillion lower today no doubt. The highly volatile derivatives market is worth noting because it dwarfs the entire world’s GDP and total financial assets combined.”

Equally chilling for the West is China’s ability to destroy the United States and European Union economies from being able to re-start their economies based on new green technologies that are wholly dependent upon rare Earth minerals, and as we can read:

“China is set to tighten its hammerlock on the market for some of the world’s most obscure but valuable minerals.

China currently accounts for 93 percent of production of so-called rare earth elements — and more than 99 percent of the output for two of these elements, vital for a wide range of green energy technologies and military applications like missiles.

Deng Xiaoping once observed that the Mideast had oil, but China had rare earth elements. As the Organization of the Petroleum Exporting Countries has done with oil, China is now starting to flex its muscle.”

sopsback said...

A pair of physicists at the Swiss Federal Institute of Technology in Zurich did a physics-based analysis of the world economy as it looked in early 2007. Stefano Battiston and James Glattfelder extracted the information from the tangled yarn that links 24,877 stocks and 106,141 shareholding entities in 48 countries, revealing what they called the "backbone" of each country's financial market. These backbones represented the owners of 80 percent of a country's market capital, yet consisted of remarkably few shareholders.”

And to the largest component of this wealth called derivatives owned by these Westerners, now called a “Time Bomb”, and with China’s actions against the West, this “house of cards” is set to explode with a force having no equal in history, and as we can further read:

“What are derivatives? Some investors describe them as "dormant economic weapons of mass destruction". They essentially are large leveraged bets on top of stocks, bonds and commodities. Money can be made within months or seconds by betting if a stock will go up, down or even remain the same. With no credit rating you can place a bet worth double your account balance. Big time investors get greater leverage with these instantaneous loans.

The New York Times, Oct 8th 2008: “The derivatives market is $531 trillion, up from $106 trillion in 2002″. This market is setup with odds similar to a racetrack. Trillions are won and lost (transferred) every second. But unlike a racetrack the big players have ultimate control. Their trillions can make stocks move. A 4% up swing in a stock can cause a derivative bet to rise more than 100% in value or vice versa. A low performing stock that rises only 6% a year could actually have many 3, 6 or 9 percent swings weekly or monthly (some stocks daily). There are billions to be made over and over again by the people that control billions and trillions thus the markets. A grand game approved by the top.

The globe's GDP is at $60.1 trillion. The globe's total financial assets were reported as $167 trillion in 2006. A few trillion lower today no doubt. The highly volatile derivatives market is worth noting because it dwarfs the entire world’s GDP and total financial assets combined.”

Equally chilling for the West is China’s ability to destroy the United States and European Union economies from being able to re-start their economies based on new green technologies that are wholly dependent upon rare Earth minerals, and as we can read:

“China is set to tighten its hammerlock on the market for some of the world’s most obscure but valuable minerals.

China currently accounts for 93 percent of production of so-called rare earth elements — and more than 99 percent of the output for two of these elements, vital for a wide range of green energy technologies and military applications like missiles.

Deng Xiaoping once observed that the Mideast had oil, but China had rare earth elements. As the Organization of the Petroleum Exporting Countries has done with oil, China is now starting to flex its muscle.”

sopsback said...

read the rest of the sotry here:

http://www.whatdoesitmean.com/index1270.htm

mogel007 said...

the irs will come after you and if you dont know what you are doing, you will get very hurt or wind up in a iron cubicle..
________________________________

IF YOU HAVE THE PAPERWORK TO BACK UP YOU FILING, WHAT'S THE PROBLEM?

THE IRS DOESN'T CARE AS LONG AS THEY GET THEIR CUT. THEY ARE THERE TO ADMINISTER THE REMEDY. I KNOW NOTHING ABOUT THIS TEST THAT YOU REFER TO OF YOUR KNOWLEDGE OF SOVERNTY AS FURTHER PROOF OF YOUR CLAIM.

THE IRS CAN BLUFF YOU & AUDIT YOU, BUT EVEN THEN, YOU AREN'T REQUIRED TO GIVE THEM ANYTHING & OCCASIONALLY THEY JAIL SOME PEOPLE, BUT WHAT % OF PEOPLE REALLY GO TO JAIL? THEY USUALLY JAIL THE TAX PROTEST LEADERS & RICH & FAMOUS PEOPLE TO SHOW AN EXAMPLE OF THEIR POWER TO KEEP EVERYONE ELSE IN LINE. THAT'S ABOUT ALL THEY DO, BUT IF YOU ARE AFRAID TO STAND UP FOR YOUR RIGHTS & WHAT YOU ARE ENTITLED TO, YOU MIGHT AS WELL GO HOME & STAY THERE.

WHEN THE IRS DOES CONTACT YOU, THEY ADDRESS YOU AS "TAXPAYER", SO WHATEVER THEY SAY IS TRUE, BECAUSE THEY ASSUME YOU ARE A "TAXPAYER", AND IF YOU FILE AS A "TAXPAYER", YOU ADMIT YOU ARE ONE, SO YOU HAVE NO RECOURSE.

THEY WON'T ANSWER DIRECT QUESTIONS THAT ARE RELEVANT. THEY JUST SEND OUT GENERAL DUNNING LETTERS THAT APPLY TO ALL CIRCUMSTANCES. THAT ISN'T PERSONAL, SO HOW CAN WHAT THEY SAY RELATE SPECIFICALLY TO YOU?

sopsback said...

But to the most curious puzzling aspect of this new economic warfare among the World’s most powerful Nations is an FSB addendum to this report stating, unequivocally, that factions within the United States aligned with their new President Barack Obama are actually supporting China in their efforts as they believe that the United States no longer has a right to stand alone astride the World as its most powerful Nation.

And towards that end these Obama “factions” are supporting those efforts to destroy the private US-European banking system called the Federal Reserve System that controls their money supply by forcing them for the first time in their history to open their books for public inspection, and as we can read as reported by the Daily Kos News Service in their report titled “The Secret That Will Destroy the World's Financial System”, and which, in part, warns:

mogel007 said...

of course, as we speak, they are developing the DTC process. depostory trust corp. where you can access the treausy acct. based on your birth cert/etc
__________________________________

Who do you know has ever made this work?

mogel007 said...

and i wouldnt hire a tila lawyer either, they will take yor money and run...i can vouch for that.
________________________________

Ok, you made a mistake in choosing a lawyer. That's your fault, not the fault of the process.

sopsback said...

THE IRS CAN BLUFF YOU & AUDIT YOU,

__________________________


that is EXACTLY MY POINT!


they will try to bluff you and most people will fall for it as they dont know UCC nor sovty rights.


and they will run to a tax lawyer who is sworn to uphold the bankruptcy.

this is what i meant by a "test'

it is not a verbal/written test like an exam.

they are going to "test' you by harassing you.

look, i didnt make this stuff up, it waht i am getting from listneng to the TNP shows and its callers


i am not saying not to do it,just that its not just a "file and forget" excercise.

some who havent studied are going to get caught and bluffed.

i would suggest that they begin listening to the tnp programs immediatly.

sopsback said...

And towards that end these Obama “factions” are supporting those efforts to destroy the private US-European banking system called the Federal Reserve System

sopsback said...

Ok, you made a mistake in choosing a lawyer. That's your fault, not the fault of the process.



whose fault is it if you get a yellow pages and litterlly call about 30 lawyers and in diff states too and none of them will take the case and for PAY, not a contingency case????


could you smmell a rat when all of a suden one turns up out of nowhere?

sopsback said...

“There's a secret out there. A secret so incredible, so horrifying, so toxic that if the public ever heard about it, it would destroy the world's financial system.

That sounds like a big claim.

Who's making it? Not some scary Chicken Littles in the Daily Kos diaries. Not some Doomer site. Not wacked-out gold bugs. Not Ron Paul.

This claim is being made by a consortium of the world's biggest and most powerful banks.

What's the secret they don't want you to know?

It all starts here:

In November of last year, the Bloomberg news organization sued the Federal Reserve bank of the United States. The goal of the suit was to force the Fed to disclose information on the alphabet soup of lending programs it created in 2008 to help prop up Wall St. banks:

Bloomberg News asked a U.S. court today to force the Federal Reserve to disclose securities the central bank is accepting on behalf of American taxpayers as collateral for $1.5 trillion of loans to banks.

The lawsuit is based on the U.S. Freedom of Information Act, which requires federal agencies to make government documents available to the press and the public, according to the complaint. The suit, filed in New York, doesn't seek money damages.

"The American taxpayer is entitled to know the risks, costs and methodology associated with the unprecedented government bailout of the U.S. financial industry," said Matthew Winkler, the editor-in-chief of Bloomberg News, a unit of New York-based Bloomberg LP, in an e-mail.

The suit sought to reveal which banks were getting which part of the $1.5 trillion dollars and what assets the banks were putting up as collateral for the loans.

The Federal Reserve fought the case and ...They lost it:

The Federal Reserve must for the first time identify the companies in its emergency lending programs after losing a Freedom of Information Act lawsuit.

Manhattan Chief U.S. District Judge Loretta Preska ruled against the central bank yesterday, rejecting the argument that loan records aren’t covered by the law because their disclosure would harm borrowers’ competitive positions.

The Fed has refused to name the financial firms it lent to or disclose the amounts or the assets put up as collateral under 11 programs, most put in place during the deepest financial crisis since the Great Depression, saying that doing so might set off a run by depositors and unsettle shareholders. Bloomberg LP, the New York-based company majority-owned by Mayor Michael Bloomberg, sued on Nov. 7 on behalf of its Bloomberg News unit.

The Federal Reserve has to identify the companies to whom it gave the $1.5 trillion dollars and it has to list the assets used as collateral for the so-called "loans."

sopsback said...

of course, as we speak, they are developing the DTC process. depostory trust corp. where you can access the treausy acct. based on your birth cert/etc
__________________________________

Who do you know has ever made this work?



who has made the OID porcess work smoothly w/o being audited and/or or reciving frivouls filing lstters which one has to defend by oneself as a tax lawyer will not defend it as then he admits that he worked to uphold the bankruptch all along.

he would face rule 11 sancionts by the judge

sopsback said...

look you dont have to bleeve me on it and i am not saying not to file the oids but i would listen to kennedy a bit first as he is on top of it weekly.


as far as noone succslfy using the dtc process, it is new and in devt as we speak.

sopsback said...

all i am saying is that kennedy was wroking the oid process and after a few bugs came up, he put his ppl on "hold" for now.

he is now wrokgin the dtc process.


his basis was that a lot of his ppl filed oid process and then lots of em got leters calling them on it. a lot panicked and quit and called lawers which cannot help as they dont reckonise the process. all they will do is make you take a plea.


k'dy says that the way things are going is to sovty altogheter.

YOU MUST KNOW WHO YOU ARE AND HOW YOU STAND BEFORE GOD.

and basiclly to shuffle paper and knw waht youre doing to stay out of the court of baal

never sing anyghing.

if you get in fornt of a jugs, then ask ???'s

nver answer them

BUT IN OREDER TO DO ALL THESE THINGS, ONE MUST KNWO WHAT THEY ARE DOON.

sopsback said...

for ex.


you do a 1099oid

irs send yo a lter.


it could be any of:


notice of audit

filing a frivilus rtn

filing a fraudulent retn

etc.


now, if know a "basic" like, "i am not a 'taxpayer"

ok, you "mail it in" as they say sending them a lter stating you are not a 'taxpayre"


tyupical: the irs ignores it, sends you anther leter with a more stern warning.

you eithe ignore it or remind them that sent them a letter telling them that you are nto a taxp;ayer or oehter such thing.

they keep sending you more warning letters.

unless you knwo whqat you are doing, eventually you will ether:

get a investicgating letter from the CID

or:

a notice of levy of you assets


now you ass/ets in deep shi*t


see how fast the water level rises without warning?


NOW TRUE, YOU CAN GET OUT OF IT, BUT LIKE I SAID, YOU MUST KNOW WHAT YOU ARE DOING AND W/O USING A LAYER. YOU MSUT KNOW SOVT/UCC/NON COMMERCIAL PROECESS

sopsback said...

NOW TRUE, YOU CAN GET OUT OF IT, BUT LIKE I SAID, YOU MUST KNOW WHAT YOU ARE DOING AND W/O USING A LAYER. YOU MSUT KNOW SOVT/UCC/NON COMMERCIAL PROECESS




WHICH THE AVG MONGOL ON DA STREET DOESNT KNOW BECASUE TEHY DONT LISTEN TO TNP radio show.... lololollolo!!!!!

sopsback said...

see, it goes to a higher level than this..

eventually all chirstians will be identified as they will have to 'come out from under the beast"

obtain sovty

and msut know what they doon to obatin it- sovty

sopsback said...

unless you knwo whqat you are doing, eventually you will ether:

get a investicgating letter from the CID

or:

a notice of levy of you assets


now you ass/ets in deep shi*t


see how fast the water level rises without warning?


NOW TRUE, YOU CAN GET OUT OF IT, BUT LIKE I SAID, YOU MUST KNOW WHAT YOU ARE DOING AND W/O USING A LAYER. YOU MSUT KNOW SOVT/UCC/NON COMMERCIAL PROECESS




this is not hearsay, this has actually happend, so agian, you must know what you are doign if youre gong to play "in the lions (or beasts) den


perhaps you should consult ken shamrock...

mogel007 said...

Accessing money from your Treasury account:

http://www.godlikeproductions.com/forum1/message866563/pg1

Alot of scams out there. Be careful.

mogel007 said...

Link not cut off:

http://www.godlikeproductions.com/
forum1/message866563/pg1

mogel007 said...

SOP said: of course, as we speak, they are developing the DTC process. depostory trust corp. where you can access the treausy acct. based on your birth cert/etc
_______________________________

So what you are in essence saying is that I should listen to a guy that is developing a process because his last process didn't work and proclaim him an expert on the subject when he doesn't have a finished proven process yet because it's still being worked out? LOL

Do you hear yourself speak?

mogel007 said...

So your advise is if you go to court, "say nothing", "admit nothing", "sign nothing".

Where do you think that is going to get you? You are in essence giving yourself "no defenses".

mogel007 said...

unless you knwo whqat you are doing, eventually you will ether:

get a investicgating letter from the CID

or:

a notice of levy of you assets
_________________________________

And if you have any assets in your personal name, than maybe you deserve what you get if you aren't protecting your assets from prying eyes.

You get an investigating letter, so what? The IRS or agencies that work with them, seem to harass whomever they want anyway, so what is your point? They don't need a reason to write you a threatening letter or put you under some soft of investigation. How do you know that you aren't being investigated yourself, even as I write this? You don't.

sopsback said...

Accessing money from your Treasury account:

http://www.godlikeproductions.com/forum1/message866563/pg1

Alot of scams out there. Be careful.




are you saying that kendy promots scams??



and thus far, NO PROCESSES have workde, oid or dtc or any other.

as you knwo, these aer all "works in progress"

mogel007 said...

are you saying that kendy promots scams??
____________________________

Are you saying he has a proven process & that he is an expert & I should listen to him because of those things?

mogel007 said...

If he has no proven process, what exactly am I missing?

sopsback said...

You get an investigating letter, so what? The IRS or agencies that work with them, seem to harass whomever they want anyway, so what is your point?



MY ;POINT IS THAT IF YOU DONT KNWO WAHT YOUR DOING, YOU CAN WIND UP IN JAIL. SIMPLE ENUF, EH??



MAYBE YOU KNOW WAHT TO DO, BUT MOST WILL NOT.

AND THE OID PROCESS IS NOT A FAILED PROCESS, AS I BLEEVE THAT KENDY HAS DONE QUIET A FEW OF THEM, BUT EVEN HE WARNS, IF YOU HAVE WEAK STOMACH, DONT TRY THEM.

MOST PPL HAVE WEEK STUMICKS, IE, THE WANT TO DO NO WORK, JUST FILE AND FORGET AND WAIT FOR THE $$$ TO SHOW UP IN THE MALE.

TIS DONT WORKS DAT WAY...

sopsback said...

mongrle, waht are we debating here/?


ppl who didnt know what they were doing have lost money time and been jialed for ti..


waht do you want me to tell you???


i did not say not to do it???


are you wating for a signed confession or somehtig???

sopsback said...

i am jsut saying that uless somehting has changed, and the irs is now recoggnizing the oids, then it is not w/o risk.

if kendy satys it, then i bleef it. it has risks. othing in life is free. everying has a cost, even if it is knowledge and with the oid as it currently is, unless there is somehing i dont knw, one msut have some knowledge to use it proeperly w/o getting jammed up.

sopsback said...

think that yo can trake "jo blow' off da steets????


thinks that he can do a oid process???? lolooloool!!!!

sopsback said...

mabye is not clar.

all dg ppl should do the oid, but they should also study it too and be preapared.


even dr. fred would tell you that knowldge is p;ower.

i will bet that even he would recommend that all those who do odi's study it as well.

he wood be the FIRST to tell you not to depent on kirk.

mogel007 said...

SOP: as far as noone succslfy using the dtc process, it is new and in devt as we speak.
_____________________________

I think you have convinced people to stay away from that process than by your own admissions. Shouldn't someone wait until someone has actually been successful at it & been paid?

Or is the proper way to address this process this way:

WHICH THE AVG MONGOL ON DA STREET DOESNT KNOW BECASUE TEHY DONT LISTEN TO TNP radio show.... lololollolo!!!!!

I ask my original question, if it's an unproven process, what am I really missing? LOL

mogel007 said...

MY ;POINT IS THAT IF YOU DONT KNWO WAHT YOUR DOING, YOU CAN WIND UP IN JAIL. SIMPLE ENUF, EH??
_________________________________

You can wind up in jail when you do know what you are doing too.
Look at Kurt & Scott.

Or are you saying that Kurt & Scott didn't know what they were doing, didn't know what they were getting into? Which is it?

mogel007 said...

Maybe in all fairness this conversation needs to take place.
Everyone deserves the rights of full disclosure no matter how unpleasant it might be.

I agree that Dorean clients need to have a strong stomach and need to educate themselves more, so they really understand what they are doing & why.

I think alot of old clients that joined the Dorean process when they were told they didn't have to make further payments, didn't think past that. They didn't really believe their discharged mortgage of record, would be challenged! Not really sure where they got that conclusion. Many thought it was a "proven process", whatever that means. Instead they thought they had won & things were over. And I think many clients didn't have a strong stomach and let their perceived rights vanish away with any hopes of a finalized victory.

I think due to that, & the history of Dorean, many will think twice about doing any further process too, or will choose not to participate at all, because no one really wants to be threatened with jail time & no one really wants to go to jail for real. Many might be bluffed out of their claim due to their own fears or their own ignorance or the inability to take a risk. Many who joined as clients never intended to fight for their own claim, but wanted a panacea done for them.

sopsback said...

You can wind up in jail when you do know what you are doing too.
Look at Kurt & Scott.

Or are you saying that Kurt & Scott didn't know what they were doing, didn't know what they were getting into? Which is it?



i dont know whetehr they knew the full ramifications or not of what they were doing.


tell you whaqt, i would bet if they had to do it all over agin, they would choose not to. my opinion.

to put it all on the line for those they dont even know to fight an oppoinent who wont let you win no matter how wrong and corrupt they are??

WOULD YOU HAVE DONE IT??

THATS ALL I WANT TO KNOW.

i bet i can certainly guess dr. freds answer would have been no. to wathch his kids/family/g/kids go thur this was not worth the trouble.

and you really cant compare kurt and scott going into it with the ave. man on the street, for they had far more knowleddge of the process and knew that win, lsoe or draw that it wouldnt be easy.

this is far differhnt than telling joe on the street,"here, fill out this oid, then go home and wate for yo check in the mail"

then when he gets an irs letter insted, he will be like "wah hoppens"????

"i thojght that you said..."

and will start blaiming hwomever tole him to do it.

why?? becasue he had no knoleldge of hte process.



totally diff cases.

sopsback said...

Many might be bluffed out of their claim due to their own fears or their own ignorance or the inability to take a risk. Many who joined as clients never intended to fight for their own claim, but wanted a panacea done for them.




E-N-U-F SAID.

E.O.S.

sopsback said...

I ask my original question, if it's an unproven process, what am I really missing? LOL



all i can say is that my oponin from lsiting to sam is that for

ALL PROCESSES YOU ARE GOING TO HAVE TO PROVE YOURSELF.


the wheat/tares sifting process is going on.

those who will are going to have to coum out from under the beast. there is risk invoeled. ether way there is risk. doing so or not doing so.

the govt. is going to get increasinly more restrictive.

the air you breath will be taxed as an exmaple.

to get out of it,you will have to come form underr the beasst. to do that, you will need to learn sovty proeccess, who you are before god.

see, its now become a whoole nother matter, a spritual one.

you dont have to bleef it, but you will see it soon at the govt. clamps down further on everthtihg.

mogel007 said...

There's something called "opportunity cost", which is also a risk consideration. If you don't take full advantage of a good opportunity, which you may not see as a good opportunity, you are risking the betterment of your financial future.

Doing nothing is also a risk that needs considering. Sometimes doing nothing is more scary than going to a place you've never been before that makes you feel uncomfortable.

sopsback said...

ALL PROCESSES YOU ARE GOING TO HAVE TO PROVE YOURSELF.



this is gong to separate the wheat from the tares.

really, it is.

and most, 99% are going to fail. they will resort to guns and militais.


rember, sup court judge rehnquist said:

"all those in jail, are there voluntarily"

there are things known now that werent even avialable to kurt himself when he was going thru the courts.

according to sam, the threat of arresting a judges bond is enuf to have him running off the bench for immodium a/c

i showed you wehre even a bar atty president admitted that he could do nthong to remove the lien unelss the claimant did it.

so a judge with no bond is no judge.

i dont think when kurt was involved at teh time that this was developled info on how to arrest a jduges bond.

mogel007 said...

tell you what, i would bet if they had to do it all over agin, they would choose not to. my opinion.
_________________________________

I think your conclusion is based upon your assumption that Kurt & Scott got nothing out of all of this but misery & the measuring balance to you says that most things were bad results instead of most things were good, hence a remorse or change of attitude would be in order if gotten a 2nd chance. You must believe Kurt & Scott are men of regrets than! If given a 2nd opportunity, you either have a regret & change your behaviour & decisions or you go with your original choices due to your own integrity which is ingrained.

What is the measuring balance here to come to such an opinionated conclusion that they would change the course of their destiny if they had a 2nd chance?

Many of us complain about our problems that we have, but if faced with doing things over, I think most of us would STILL choose to do the same things & face the same punishments or the same conclusions of our lives. That's my opinion. If life is a smorgasbord of problems & blessings, we as individuals would still be attracted to the same things on the table of life that make us what we are.

I don't believe Kurt & Scott are men of regrets. You don't have to like everything about your circumstances. They did what they did because they were compelled to do it, due to their love for the truth & their desire to be courageous to that.

So I respectfully disagree with you.

mogel007 said...

SOP: does this sound like a man of regret?

"Victories and vindication will be ordinary to you."

"They did obtain extraordinary victories over time in the ordinary course of being themselves only because they believed God's word true."

Is this not foreshadowing that Kurt believes that in the end he will be vindicated, so why would there be room for regret?

If you are a man of faith & God has chosen you for a work, would you than change your decisions if given a 2nd chance because the work is uncomfortable?

Did not Kurt many times say that the Dorean Process was not of man, but God inspired in essence?

So if Kurt had regrets, & if you believe him that the process came from on high, aren't you also saying that Kurt has regrets or doubts that God will fulfill his promises of vindication and justice?

Maybe in your short sighted opinionation, you have failed to acknowledge & value the Dorean Group's true character & faith?

Maybe I'm just too sensitive sometimes, but I think your opinion is hurtful.

sopsback said...

What is the measuring balance here to come to such an opinionated conclusion that they would change the course of their destiny if they had a 2nd chance?


i am not demeaning them at all.

but, its jsut my opinoin.

am i entitled to one or does jsut what you say coutn??

my opinion is based on FAMILY.

you talk as if the only way for them to serve god is by the dg?

ive earned my own 'stripes' to be entitled to an opinoin

an right or wroing, my opinion is that they wuold not make the sacs agian for the sake of their family.


i also dont think that ppl being waht they are, they wont be appreciated for what theyve done.

all ppl will see is that they took way too long to delvier on their claims.

ppl today dont udnerstand and msot dont want to hear that the govt. is a crimianl enterpirse.

i should know, becoss noone listems to me when i tell them.

sopsback said...

ever lsiten to kendys show?

yo knwo the kind of nonsesne hate mail that he puts up with?

all hes trying to do is help ppl, just llike k and s are

sopsback said...

look my friend, i have enuf HS wisdom to go head to head with anyone, bar none, including kurt, dr, fred, any "paster" on the planet.

after all, if you rember, i am the ones that told them to follow the HS in their gut, and not ANY PASTOR who said that it would be rapped up and finished by dec. 07

who was right?

me or the copy and "paster"??

sopsback said...

with all doo repects to that woman paster, she was a fraud and still is.

sopsback said...

fact is, like i said before, the "beast" isnt letting anyone go easily from teir grip, but you must kick the beast in the teeth.

and trying to use a court/layers which is sworn to uphold the bankruptcy is not kicking the beast in the teeth

sopsback said...

but in a way, like i aslo said, perhaps it wont matter.

i do bleef that there is soemting to the 2011-12 prpecy so by then it wont matter and will be long forgetton abuot the dg, dtc, oid, etc

thsi is fact, the earth mag field is changing from +/- and a lot of destruction worldwide is going to be the result.

mogel007 said...

An interesting defense against the IRS. Treat them as a debt collection agency & have them validate the debt & make them follow the FDCPA:

http://youroidremedy.com/images/
how-to-stop-the-irs-with-debt-collection-statutes_1_.pdf

mogel007 said...

I'm not trying to be demeaning either, but "for a fat girl, you sure don't sweat very much." LOL

sopsback said...

funny, just as i am talking about kendy....i get this


From: Sam-Kennedy ..
Sent: Thu 9/03/09 3:43 PM



Hi Folks,

Sunday night, just look at these topics on TAKE NO PRISONERS:

Crushing the a-turn-on-me in court (actual case; actual methods; a wealth of actual enforcement).

EASILY converting a default judgment into sudden victory.

Quashing a subpoena (grand jury or otherwise).

Securities certificates and certificated securities. (Why are you still talking about Birth Certificates?)

Who is the registered Beneficiary on the certificated securities being held in your name (YOU are.
NOT the United States. Did you not know?)

YOU are registered Beneficiary of the Trust. NOT the United States.

What trust? (We will tell you what it is, and how to identify it BY NAME).

We will identify THE TRUST INSTRUMENT you have been operating under all of your life.
It surely is NOT the birth certificate.
And yet, the granting instrument has been in front of your eyes all this time.

Drawer, drawee, payor, payee. (Unless you know who and what they are, you cannot gain your remedy).

Why you are using the 1099-A INCORRECTLY. The patriot gospel about this form is just plain wrong.

Enforcing promissory notes. YES, promissory notes.
Despite your tiring of them, properly used you can END YOUR CASE IN A HEARTBEAT right in their courtroom.
ENFORCEMENT is not an illusion, it is your remedy as was proven once again by one
of the RETURN OF PROCESS attendees last week upon having his case dismissed.

ALL OF THESE TOPICS WERE COVERED IN MUCH DETAIL AT THE RETURN OF PROCESS seminar. For example, not one attendee understood how a 1099-A is interpreted by IRS. The idea that Box 5 determines an acquisition or abandonment is so nonsensical it identifies us as easy prey.

If you are hanging your hat on box 5, then you are at risk.

The 1099-A ALWAYS reports BOTH abandonment AND acquisition. Did you not know that before you decided to use it? When a claim is abandoned, the property is considered acquired by the lender. We will explore the 1099-A in specific detail to reduce the risks many of our listeners are undertaking unnecessarily.

Folks, that list of topics just begins to scratch the surface. WE are the registered beneficiary of the securities certificates. WE are the registered Beneficiary of the certificated B-E securities represented by the certificates in our possession. WE are the registered Beneficiary of THE trust. WE hold the power to stop their tricks, as everyone at the ROP seminar now knows. WE hold the power of arrest. WE hold the power to repel arrest. WE have the ability to quash a summons or subpoena and make it impossible for the prosecutor to make a move without confessing to high crimes. WE can make them put up or shut up. All of this was demonstrated in abundance to our wonderful group of attendees, as many of you may have heard by now. It was by far my best effort, and I thank the lord for the blessing. Attendees left with a tangible grasp of how to turn the corporation OFF …

using nothing but a few sheets of paper

or a five-step simple inside-the-courtroom technique.

sopsback said...

cot'd




Given the response on-site in Albany, a decision was made on the last day of the meeting to make this information more widely available. So I am pleased to announce the following very special events quite literally fresh off the drawing board:

1. RETURN OF PROCESS seminar – a FOUR day event November 20, 21, 22 and 23 in Albany, New York, in which you will learn how to shut the corporation DOWN



and the

2. CRUSHING THE COURTROOM event, a very special THREE day course November 6, 7 and 8 also in Albany, where we can craft our skills BEFORE they are needed. if you tune in this Sunday night to TAKE NO PRISONERS, you will see just how easily we can dismiss the predators in their own house.


Crushing the Courtroom came about because, quite unexpectedly, about half of the RETURN OF PROCESS seminar became devoted to standing in that den of vipers and sending them packing with tears in their eyes. The feedback has been most kind, the desire for this type of training is now apparent, and I have decided to focus for the next few months on bolstering the skills and confidence of patriots in facing down the predators. In my opinion, this community needs to have skills consistent with their dreams of freedom.

IN ADDITION, we may also have time to comment on the global remedy we discussed with Tom Schaults during last Sunday’s broadcast of TAKE NO PRISONERS (September 30, 2009). You may want to download that broadcast in the Republic Broadcasting Network archives.

So I hope you will join me live this Sunday night, September 6th, at 8 PM EST on RBN, for an ambitious broadcast of TAKE NO PRISONERS at:

http://republicbroadcasting.org/



TAKE NO PRISONERS is carried live on FM stations around the nation and on Shoutcast (using the free Shoutcast application on iPhones and other handhelds). Or, you can listen live directly on the internet at the above web address.

sopsback said...

I'm not trying to be demeaning either, but "for a fat girl, you sure don't sweat very much." LOL




????????????????????

sopsback said...

IN ADDITION, we may also have time to comment on the global remedy we discussed with Tom Schaults during last Sunday’s broadcast of TAKE NO PRISONERS (September 30, 2009). You may want to download that broadcast in the Republic Broadcasting Network archives.



dtc process??

sopsback said...

WE hold the power of arrest.



and wel will let bonnie fif enforce it jug beans...LOLOLLOOOLOL!!!!

sopsback said...

but anyway, seeing as weve reached where we have, go ahead, let it all hang out, i am a big boy, i can take it.

but i may say things also that you may not like.

so be it.


its an adult world here.

dont hold back.

sopsback said...

jsut like wehn i held back that my "gut' tole me that that "ferret" guy was a rodent from day one...i could jsut feel it. but waht am i goanna do, call dr. fred and tell him his sons friend/bus asscte. is a molerat? prob for the fbi?

i wasnt gong to tell him that.

mogel007 said...

SOP said: an right or wroing, my opinion is that they wuold not make the sacs agian for the sake of their family.
_________________________________

What did Jesus say about "family". "He that does not deny father, mother, sister, or brother, IS NOT WORTHY OF ME if there is ever a conflict between the two. Isn't he talking about sacrifices? Who has priority in your life? God or family?

In other words, all the Bible quoting & stories that Kurt talks about are all meaningless anyway since he couldn't really believe them anyway, is what you are really saying.

Jesus said: "I have not come to bring peace but a sword".....to divide families in other words.

You are in essence saying that due to family, the Dorean Group should have put family first instead of God's wishes, given a 2nd chance.

If you had any Holy Spirit in you on this specific subject, & it's my opinion, you don't, you would recognize those scriptures & the point I'm trying to make.

Can you follow God & please family, if those things just happen to be diametrically opposed sometimes?

If Scott wanted to please his family only (X wife specifically), he would have never gotten involved with Dorean or specifically involved with Kurt. He could have been like Jonah, the prophet, in some respects, choosing to run away from what God wanted him to do.

I don't think Scott's X & Kurt are exactly best of friends throughout the entire history of all of this, do you? Scott got divorced over all of this & his stance to do the right thing. Getting punished by doing the right thing & not acknowledging one's true & real intentions behind all of their work & choices? That's not demeaning or hurtful, than what really is?

You might as well be one of the accusors that said that the Dorean Group were only in it for the money and didn't leave the country in time & if given the 2nd chance, that's what they would have done.

Kurt mentioned that if Scott's X didn't change, that cancer could/would spread to her body. Have you forgotten the uproar that this cancer post made? I believe that such a warning is difficult to hear, even from a friend.

You're not trying to be deameaning, except you fail to acknowledge all of the history & the origions of why the Dorean Group was created in the first place, which really is the same thing as being unthoughtful or demeaning or imperceptive. Can you have the Holy Ghost when you are imperceptive in your words or opinions? You believe you can obviously.

It's like your wife cooks you the best dinner of your life, and gets a total makeover just for you for a special night & you don't recognize or acknowledge it or appreciate why she is doing it. But of course, you didn't mean to be deameaning or hurtful in your lack of perceptions. And of course, you shouldn't be expected to be called on the carpet either for your position, right? You've earned your stripes, after all, you are the man of the house. You put the food on the table by your employment & that's her job to be pretty all the time & make dinner ontime anyway. LOL

mogel007 said...

I'm not trying to be demeaning either, but "for a fat girl, you sure don't sweat very much." LOL




????????????????????
_______________________________

What am I saying, you're not a sily little girl. What was I thinking???????????????

I mean for a fat person, you should sweat more, but you don't, so how could you really be fat????????

When I said that the steak you cooked me last night was "tough", what I really meant to say that it was that it was "hip", "boss", "cool", you know, "right on.", keep rocking dude!!!!

mogel007 said...

jsut like wehn i held back that my "gut' tole me that that "ferret" guy was a rodent from day one...i could jsut feel it. but waht am i goanna do, call dr. fred and tell him his sons friend/bus asscte. is a molerat? prob for the fbi?

i wasnt gong to tell him that.
______________________________

Would it have made a difference?
I think not.

He was no molerat in the beginning. He was one of the "successful brokers." At least that's what he truly believes and what he told people, including myself.

After all "success means never having to say that you went to jail."

Or does it mean "never having to say that you are sorry".

I don't know, I get success & love mixed up sometimes.

sopsback said...

What did Jesus say about "family". "He that does not deny father, mother, sister, or brother, IS NOT WORTHY OF ME if there is ever a conflict between the two. Isn't he talking about sacrifices? Who has priority in your life? God or family?


Jesus said: "I have not come to bring peace but a sword".....to divide families in other words.



mongol, your making the ERROR that everone else makes.



jesus was talking to JEW NON BELEIVERS.

THIS DOES NOT APPLY TO CHRISTIAN TODAY UNLESS THEIR PARENTS ARE ALSO NON BLEEVERS.

so your first ERROR in doctrine here is that your quoted scripture applies to kurt, and maybe it does, but 2 htings you make great assumptions about:

1. doing the dg process is serving christ by leaving family whicdh i dont bleef that it does. christ would not have done the dg process strickly speaking as it has nthing to do with salvation.


2. you aer asuuming that kurts family was not christian already. i am not aware of this, are you?

was kurts wife at the time christian. certainly dr. fred is, so your verse doesnt apply here. its drieceted to jews to leave theri family and follow christ not for chirstians to leave their family who already follow christ.

mogel007 said...

you talk as if the only way for them to serve god is by the dg?
_________________________

Nice job in twisting my words, but if you are called to do a specific job & you ignore it, you aren't serving God or following his promptings.

You of all people who claim to have the Spirit should recognize that truth.

mogel007 said...

jesus was talking to JEW NON BELEIVERS
_________________________

How convenient. I could say that about any passage of scripture I wanted to ignore.

sopsback said...

i am not demeaning anyhone for any reason.

look, kurt did what he felt that he had to do and made great sacrifice for it for the sake fo his family..

but truth is, this is not the same as chirst saying leave your family and follow me.

hard feeligs or no hard feelings, it just isnt. sorry!


and this is NOT the same as telling kurt what he should have or should not have done. that is his business between him and god, not me.

only he and god knows the reason why he did it, but i will bet you still, if i asked him face to face if he would do it over agian, i still bet that he would not have. my opinoin. flollwong christ has nothing to do with it.

and i have never said that the dg was a scam. have you ever seen where i wrote that?

sopsback said...

look a t of ppl get 'caught up' in things..

just look at burly baal, and his own admission 3" thick notebook of 300 HYPEs that nver pay a dime despite him always sahying for each one:

THIS IS THE REAL DEAL FOLKS!

THIS IS GOING TO BE BIG!

GET IN NOW WHILE YOU STILL CAN!


does this mean that burly baal is a bad guy?

of course not, but he is misgueided on a lot of thins re:HYPEs

sopsback said...

jesus was talking to JEW NON BELEIVERS
_________________________

How convenient. I could say that about any passage of scripture I wanted to ignore.



you could say anything you want to, but in fact, this is who he was talking to>



who then is he talking to??

chirstians then??? LOL!!!



waht? is he then telling christians to leave their already chirstian family to follow him to do waht???

fish? build a shed?

come on, mogrel, that makes no sesne,even to you!


and jsut for the record, 99% of waht he said IS deirected to jew non bleefers.

otherwise, who is he trying to convert??? christians to waht if they are alredy christian????

sopsback said...

like i said, 2-3 years, '011-12 it wont mattter.

these discussins will all fade away one way or the other.


you are going to see changes in the next few years that noone has seen in theri lifes before.


erthes mag field causing quaks/torndos/h'canes/tsusnamis/floods/droughts/you name it, its coming...

and thank god, SO IS THE RAPTOON! LOLOLOL!!!

mogel007 said...

SOP said: jesus was talking to JEW NON BELEIVERS.

THIS DOES NOT APPLY TO CHRISTIAN TODAY UNLESS THEIR PARENTS ARE ALSO NON BLEEVERS.
_________________________________

I can't believe you actually believe what you just said. In other words, if you have family that are Christians, they can't take you away from your path & specific mission or duties in following God & Christ THAT YOU WERE CALLED TO? In other words, you believe if you family are all Christians, there is never a conflict between them & God? What make believe world do you live in Alice? Maybe you are a silly little girl after all? Not sure about the fat part.

Your statement reminds me of a Pastor I listen to on the radio because I find him so amusing.

He uses the same type of logic you are saying. The scripture where Christ talks about when he will be coming back will be like a "thief in the night" & basically says: "No man knows the end times or when I will come back not even the angels...etc."

In spite of that plain scripture that certain things are just private with God, & not revealed yet, you have all of these prophets predicting the end of the world. There is a movie coming out in November of this year about this & the catastophies to soon come. The Mayans believe that the calendar ends on December 21, 2012 as the end of the world, or as many Christians believe, the rapture date.

Invariably all prophets that predict a specific date of this event, HAVE ALL BEEN EMBARASSED & HAVE ALL BEEN WRONG IN THE PAST, SO I EXPECT THAT TREND TO CONTINUE.

Anyway, this pastor says that this scripture only referred to the people in Jesus's day, that no man knoweth the end of the world, and that this doesn't apply to us today, for according to him & the scriptures, he has figured out that the end of the world, "the rapture" will happen on May 21, 2011 & he's TOTALLY CONVINCED THAT THE BIBLE HAS GIVEN HIM THIS DATE. NO QUESTION AT ALL IN HIS MIND. IT IS A FACT TO HIM.

Well when May 21, 2011 comes & goes, I predict this idiot will still be preaching & there will be more idiots believing him because they don't read the scriptures or have the Holy Spirit & they'll forgive his prediction.

How many predictions of doom & gloom have you been wrong about on the dates that you have believed in?

Enough said?

mogel007 said...

SOP: Weren't we suppose to have a banking HOLIDaY A WEEK AGO?

mogel007 said...

SOP: Did the 12 apostles leave their families to follow Christ?

THEY MUST HAVE BEEN NONBELIEVING JEWS THAN< all of them, ACCORDING TO YOU?????

mogel007 said...

and jsut for the record, 99% of waht he said IS deirected to jew non bleefers.
________________________

plain B>s

sopsback said...

if you have family that are Christians, they can't take you away from your path & specific mission or duties in following God & Christ THAT YOU WERE CALLED TO?



sure you can leave your already christian family IF AND ONLY IF what casue you are persuing in STRICTLY INVOLVED IN WITNESS FOR AND CONVERTING THOSE TO CHRIST.


you cannot just apply this to a business venture.

dont forget, if leaaving your already chirstian family puts a hardship on you children/wife and caouses a divorce etc.

YOU THINK THAT CHRIST WANTS THAT???/


so then what did your familiy beocme chirstian for?

to be fatherless and husbankless???


makes no sense.

if anyting, it would turn one away from chirstiantiy.

sorry, mog...the only reason to leave an already christian family is PERHAPS gather others for christ, and i am not totally 100% sure about that eiether.

i know this, tha christ would surely not want one to abandon an alrady christian family for any kind of business deal. athats for sure.

sopsback said...

and as far as 11-12 goes, i am not say8ing that i know the day or the hour.

i just have a feeling that there is something in these dates.

not even sayhing that its the rapurte.

altho for sure the erths mag feeld is shifting.

that is not specualtion.

sopsback said...

sure you can leave your already christian family IF AND ONLY IF what casue you are persuing in STRICTLY INVOLVED IN WITNESS FOR AND CONVERTING THOSE TO CHRIST.


and on htis i wont judge.

thats gods business, not mine.

did the dg casue those to come to christ is the question.

god knows the asnwer, not me. so i "judge not" nor do i jduge what kurt did eether. that not my business.

all i do is interrpert scrupture as i kknow it from the HS

sopsback said...

sure you can leave your already christian family IF AND ONLY IF what casue you are persuing in STRICTLY INVOLVED IN WITNESS FOR AND CONVERTING THOSE TO CHRIST.



if those who joined werre already bleeffers, then noone was converted.

like anyone else, they simply wanted there deps paid to keep there house.


am not saying that this was the case, just that if it was, then this has nothing to do with witness/convertion to christ

simpley a business desicsion.

sopsback said...

simpley a business desicsion.


WHICH WILL PROLBLY TURN OUT TOE BE A GOOD ONE! ;-)

sopsback said...

SOP: Did the 12 apostles leave their families to follow Christ?

THEY MUST HAVE BEEN NONBELIEVING JEWS THAN< all of them, ACCORDING TO YOU?????


YOU ANSERED YOU OWN QUESTIN, THANK YOU.

THE APOSTLES LEFT THEIR NON BLEEFING JEW FAMILIES.

come on, thats an easy one.

if not, then what? they left thier chirstian family.

you are plain starting to not make any sense here.




Blogger mogel007 said...

and jsut for the record, 99% of waht he said IS deirected to jew non bleefers.
________________________

plain B>s


IN YOUR OPINION MY FRIEND.

sopsback said...

but then again, you probly beef that the millenial kingdom can come in w/o christ too.

all bills paid, prosperity packs for eeryone. no wars, famins, peace everywhere all under the awspices of the a/c.

it aint happenin like that.

only ones gonna show up is the 2 lampstands whom everyone will hate for exposing there evil.

sopsback said...

rember one thins, dont get mad at the messengers when thins dont happen like you think...evrytins just gong to be find and dandy.

in fact, the swing flu pandemic is going to begin to change that idea right away.

mogel007 said...

All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
All. 2Sa 23:2 Mt 21:42 22:31,32,43 26:54,56 Mr 12:24,36 Joh 10:35 Ac 1:16 28:25 Ro 3:2 15:4 Ga 3:8 Heb 3:7 4:12 2Pe 1:19-21

Course if you're SOP, you believe 99% of scripture is only directed to the unbelieving Jews. LOL

Jesus said to Peter long after he followed him & left his family: "When you art CONVERTED , strengthen thy brethren."

Peter denied Christ three times. So tell me, SOP, was Peter a believing Christian, when he left his ALLEGED nonbelieving family or wife to serve & follow the Lord? You asked me how would I knew Kurt & Scott's family were Christians, yet you totally assume that the apostles families were nonbelieving Jews with no POSSIBLE knowledge of how their families OR WIVES believed? How hypocritical is that?

When does a believer really become a Christian? When did Peter become a Christian? Can you be a believer and DENY THE LORD? What makes a Jew a nonbeliever than? Is it because they deny the Lord & don't acknowledge him? I think you are being a little bit too judgmental here, or please define things.

mogel007 said...

It's not reasonable that the families & wives of the 12 apostles were non believing Jews. They were also followers of Jesus & believers of Jesus too.

mogel007 said...

SOP said: but then again, you probly beef that the millenial kingdom can come in w/o christ too.

all bills paid, prosperity packs for eeryone. no wars, famins, peace everywhere all under the awspices of the a/c.
________________________________
Why would I believe that the millenial kingdom can come in w/o christ? That's the dumbest thing you've said to date.

If all bills paid, prosperity packs, HYIP, etc. are under the aspices of the A/C, why do you promote them & look forward to their payouts? LOL


What are you talking about? You need to read your scriptures.
The millenial reign, HERE ON EARTH IS where there are no wars, no famine, peace abounds, "when the lamb lays down with the lion without any ire..."" is when Jesus does come back to the earth. The anti-christ is not here on the earth during the 1,000years of peace.

So you believe that the millenial reign with Christ is where their is no war is under the auspicious of the anti-christ? The anti-christ has long been killed & is no longer on the earth. What are you smoking? LOL

sopsback said...

Peter denied Christ three times. So tell me, SOP, was Peter a believing Christian, when he left his ALLEGED nonbelieving family or wife to serve & follow the Lord?



i dont know at what instant peter became a christian, ie, filled with the HS.

DO YOU?

so when he denied him, it is very possilbe that he wasnt yet indwelled with the HS

and the second part of you ? ive ansered a few times now and you ignore it and keep going over and over it.

peter left his non bleeving fmaily to follow jesus, yes.

at the time he left,
HE WAS NOT A BLEFFING CHIRSTIAN. you dont just beomce indwelle with teh HS the moment that you start follwokng jesus. how many start and then fail...by the wayside.

what is so hard to understnad about this?

i dont bleef that ANY fo the apostles were bleefers right ast the start. remver, you MUST BE TESTED.

judas follwoed jesus rught till the end when he set him up; was HE A BLEEFER TO jsut becsue he follwed jesus??


doesnt this work like real life?

someone "follwos" someone pretiending to be a "discipel" of hteirs and then they turn on them.

didnt kurts "disciples" do the same thing as judas did?

so becoss they follwoed kurt at the bdginnging, did this mean that they were bleefers in the dg?

of course not. and when they were 'tested' they failed msierably.


same with yeshuas disciples.

mogel007 said...

SOP said: "i just have a feeling that there is something in these dates."
_________________________________
May 21, 2011.... December 21, 2012...rature, end of the world...?

PURE CONJECTURE!!! THAT'S WHY ANYONE PURPORTING TO KNOW THE END OF THE WORLD IS SO COMICAL. IT BECOMES A RELIGION TO THEM, A FACT IN THEIR MIND.

sopsback said...

Distributor ID # 10286625

which you will need to place an order as a preferred customer.
This is going to be big. Get in now. I joined this company primarily to be able to buy their product TAIslim, which is a weightloss product that works really

sopsback said...

"This is going to be big."



where i heard this beefo???

LOLOLOLOLOL!!!!!!

sopsback said...

mongol,

youre getting it wrong.

whne i say "dates" i dont mean "days"

i think that the YEARS will turn out to be significant.

ie, that by the time '13 rolls around, we will be living in a different 'paradigm' as they say.


call it what you will, rapture, ascension...aleins, ufos...famins, WWIII, quakes, etc, wahtver you like


this is my feeling.

mogel007 said...

SOP said: "simpley a business desicsion.


WHICH WILL PROLBLY TURN OUT TOE BE A GOOD ONE! ;-)"
______________________________

SO YOU MUST BELIEVE THAT: NOT ALL GOOD THINGS COME FROM CHRIST THAN, SINCE IT WAS JUST A BUSINESS DECISION & CHRIST HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH THE PROCESS SINCE CHRIST ISN'T INTERESTED IN BUSINESS AT ALL?

ON ONE HAND YOU SAY IT WILL TURN OUT WELL, BUT CHRIST HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH IT? HOW FUNNY IS THAT?

CHRIST ISN'T INTERESTED IN OUR BUSINESS, SO WE SHOULDN'T PRAY ABOUT BUSINESS DECISIONS THAN? LOL

sopsback said...

This is going to be big. Get in now. I joined this company primarily to be able to buy their product Alslim, which is a...


wonda if Alslim is jug allslops new product??


really gong to be big

mogel007 said...

SOP: Are you suggesting that when things turn out well for Dorean clients that they should thank the Anti-Christ since Christ is not interested in our business decisions?

I think you are. LOL

sopsback said...

and btw, when yo were talking yesterday about being a little child, rember,

YOU MIND MUST BE LIKE A LITTLE INNOCENT CHILD TO ENTER THE KINGDOM OF HEAVEN.


ONLY THEN DOES GOD PROTECT YOU.


ALSO REMBER:

GOD USES THE WEAK/FOOLISH THINGS OF THIS WORLD TO CONFOUND THE STRONG/WISE



so call me a little child all yo like. it dont bother me casue i know that the HS prtoects 'little ones'

sopsback said...

SOP: Are you suggesting that when things turn out well for Dorean clients that they should thank the Anti-Christ since Christ is not interested in our business decisions?





NO! YOU ARE SAYING THAT.


i said that christ is not interested in this worlds business decisions as it hsa NOTHING to do with salvation.

thats bringing business into the temple which christ forbade.

sopsback said...

see, the porblem that peple dont understnad is, and even i udnerstand it but cant always practice it, is that you canot use christ ti benefit/gain in this world as it is satans kingdom.


thsi is why the jews reject yeshua.


its like why bother to build a bank account when YOU CANT SPEND IT HERE.

but in the next life..treasuers in heaven, rember?

but to follow chirst here and build up treasures in heaven casuses suffering which most do not want to do because tehy cannot see the benefit here in thiws wrold

to get ahead in theis world you must follow for the great part satans principles.


becaue it is his kingdom.


would you let anyone take anything away from you if it was yours to begin with?

of course not.

mogel007 said...

You said: THE APOSTLES LEFT THEIR NON BLEEFING JEW FAMILIES.

This statement infers that the apostles were Christians & left them in honor because you say that their famililes were nonbelievers, or everything that you say makes no sense.

Than you backpeddle & change your position & say:

"i dont know at what instant peter became a christian, ie, filled with the HS."

sopsback said...

and it is also why i question if the dg will ultimaetely win as teh courts they are using are controlled by ball...i mean baaal


and you know about ball and his 450+ prophets...i mean baal and his 450+ profits..."waht it prophet a man....

sopsback said...

This statement infers that the apostles were Christians & left them in honor because you say that their famililes were nonbelievers, or everything that you say makes no sense.

Than you backpeddle & change your position & say:

"i dont know at what instant peter became a christian, ie, filled with the HS."





its not backpedalling at all, you jsut cant seem to understnad it, or pretend not to.



last time:


TEH APOSTLE LEFT THEIR NON BLEEVING FAMILIES TO FOLLOW A PATH THAT LEADS TO BEING A BLEEVER, IE FILLED WITH THE HS.

THEY DID NOT BECOME BLEEFERS THE INSTANT THEY LEFT THEIR FAMILEIS, BUT LATYER ON.



WHAT IS SO HARD TO UNDERSTAND ABOUT THIS?????


mogel, you dont have ADD do you?

sopsback said...

well, ive left enfu here to chew on.

now i will let time reveal the truth.

just like i say that the woman pastor would be completely wrong about teh dec. 07 finsih for the dg.

i told kurt to follow his own feelings adn not depent on the fraud woman paster.

sopsback said...

TEH APOSTLE LEFT THEIR NON BLEEVING FAMILIES TO FOLLOW A PATH THAT LEADS TO BEING A BLEEVER, IE FILLED WITH THE HS.

THEY DID NOT BECOME BLEEFERS THE INSTANT THEY LEFT THEIR FAMILEIS, BUT LATYER ON.





AND IN FACT, IT WORKS THIS WAY FOR EVERYONE.

YOU DONT JUST BECOME A BLEEVER JSUT BECAUSE YOU UTTER THE WORDS: "I BLEEF IN JESUS AS MY LORD AND SAVIOUR"


thsi is the fallacy that the false chruchs teach, not me.


yo gotta hang on the cross first one way, the other.


so if youve had an easy life, cahnces are you havent had your faith tested. cahnces are you are not yet filled with the HS. CAHNCES ARE, YOU ARE NOT A TRUE BLEEFER YET, BUT THINK THAT YOU ARE, THUS FOOLING YOURSELF, BUT NOT GOD.

mogel007 said...

SOP said: "so then what did your familiy beocme chirstian for?

to be fatherless and husbankless???
_________________________________

According to you, it matters not, because your one dimensional God is only interested in salvation, not interested in family circumstances or financial challenges or business decisions.
Choosing to divorce is much like a business decision, because it affects you financially. Don't believe that? Finances is one of the three reasons why people divorce. Do you think woman don't use that as a consideration in their decision to marry?

That's one of the main reasons why Jesus was so against divorce. It affects posterity & generations to follow & than affects the strength of the body of Christ, the believers as a whole when you have fatherless or motherless children that can't suppor themselves. The Jews were always big on dowery's & inheritances & keeping the wealth in their family lines. When you divorce, you screw that inheritance up.

Why are the Jews & Arabs fighting today? It all started back with the rights of inheritances in Jacob's day between Esau & his brother. The wars in the middle east stems from a grudge between brothers that happened thousands of years earlier that has only gotten worse over time.

mogel007 said...

YOU DONT JUST BECOME A BLEEVER JSUT BECAUSE YOU UTTER THE WORDS: "I BLEEF IN JESUS AS MY LORD AND SAVIOUR"
_____________________________

Tell that to all the people that believe they are "saved" & can even tell you the date that they were saved. Their the same people that can give you a date when the world is going to end. Salvation to them is an event, not a process.

mogel007 said...

SOP said: i dont know at what instant peter became a christian, ie, filled with the HS.

DO YOU?
_________________________________

Well he couldn't be filled with the Holy Ghost while Jesus was on the earth, so according to you, Peter was NEVER A CHRISTIAN while Jesus was alive, so, so much for the idea that salvation is an event.

The Holy Ghost could not come to the earth until Jesus left the earth, so Jesus said :

http://wiki.answers.com/
Q/Why_did_the_Holy_Spirit_
come

No need for the Holy Ghost on the earth when Jesus is the light of the world anyway & while he was here.

mogel007 said...

SOP said: so then what did your familiy beocme chirstian for?

to be fatherless and husbankless???

makes no sense.
________________________________

Don't most fundamentalist Christians believe that in the afterlife there are no marriages or family units in heaven anyway? It makes sense to them apparently. To them, family units are an earthly thing or someething temporary, like the vow, "until death do you part." It's even initiated in the typical marriage ceremony. To them you become married in this life to be single in the next life. LOL

mogel007 said...

SOP said: "christ would not have done the dg process strickly speaking as it has nthing to do with salvation."
_____________________________

So you are saying that the process did not come from Christ as Kurt says?

mogel007 said...

SOP said: "all bills paid, prosperity packs for eeryone. no wars, famins, peace everywhere all under the awspices of the a/c."
________________________________

Isn't the Dorean Process a prosperity pack program? Doesn't the process insinuate that your mortgage was paid? Isn't the "birth certificate" program you refer to that kennedy talka bout is about getting "all bills paid" through the Treasury? He's the guy that "you believe whatever he says". Do you really believe all such programs are administered by the anti-christ?

No wars, peace, prosperity, he would get my vote.

mogel007 said...

SOP said: "christ would not have done the dg process strickly speaking as it has nothing to do with salvation."
________________________________

What things specifically have to do with salvation? Don't ALL THE WORDS or commands or directions of Christ count & have something to do with our individual salvation & our well being? Oh that's right, 99% of the words of Christ have nothing to do with the believing Christian, how can I forget??????? LOL

If jesus tells you to do something & you ignore it, is your salvation in jeopardy? Is God pleased?

Jesus said, "It is not good for man to be alone." "What God joins, let no man put asunder". Basically marriage is ordained of God. I don't think many will disagree with me on that subject.

Yet those same people & your type of thinking is like the typical christian thinking: well marriage has nothing to do with salvation, even though Jesus ordained it and proclaimed it to be a good thing for man, but in the same breath they'll say, Jesus wasn't married & couldn't have been married, even though Jesus/God is the one who instituted this practice among men with our first parents, Adam & Eve & was the author of the practice.

You say: "Dorean Process has nothing to do with salvation, so Jesus wouldn't do the process." Yet you deny Kurt's testimony that he was prompted by the Spirit to start the Dorean Group because he believes even now that Jesus was the author of the process.

It's an utter contradiction by you SOP & you are unable to see it, yet you say things will turn out well for people.

Jesus wouldn't do the process because it would turn out well for people in the end? LOL

You're an expert on all the words of Christ? On everything pertaining to salvation for yourself & others? You're incapable of believing a lie? If the Devil has any power over you whatsoever, are you saved? What are you saved from? What kind of salvation is it, if the Devil has any power over you?

No, you don't know everything about salvation! It's arrogant of anyone to profess such a doctrine. The scriptures say, "you must work out your salvation with fear and trembling." Why? Because we don't know it all. No one does. And it all can't be revealed without Christ. At least we can agree that's it's not an event. That's a good start. The scriptures also say, "you must endure to the end, to be saved." Do you know EVERYTHING ABOUT THAT? I submit you don't, anymore than you know "all the words of Christ".

mogel007 said...

I should know all of this, but maybe someone can help me? I have some questions:

1. Do personal property taxes or real estate taxes at the County tax office become a personal debt that is owed?

2. If they are a debt, than does the County tax office become subject to following the laws of the Fair Debt Collections Practices Act?

3. Is this government entity considered a debt collector?

3. If back taxes accrued, are not considered a debt, can the County tax office than legally sue for back taxes, get a judgment against an individual & garnish wages?

4. Does anyone have any experience where the County Tax Office has in fact sued someone personally?

sopsback said...

2. If they are a debt, than does the County tax office become subject to following the laws of the Fair Debt Collections Practices Act?



technically yes, as all cities, counties, states etc, are a Corp.© ,but like the dg, triing to prove it is anther matter. good lunck!

sopsback said...

SOP said: "christ would not have done the dg process strickly speaking as it has nthing to do with salvation."
_____________________________

So you are saying that the process did not come from Christ as Kurt says?




no. i dont bleef that yeshua would have had anything to do with the dg.


i dont agree with evverything taht kurt says.

i didnt agree with him on the woman paster who gave him false prophecy on the dec 07 dg end date.

it also doesnt mean that i think that kurt is a bad guy either.


you need to ask him about the dg/christ realtionship.


see, its not about the dg, its that christ would not have gotten involed in ANY business ventur as it has notheing to do with salvation.

you can be a crooked businessman and be saveed and an honest businessman and not be saved.

ex. there are many honest busienmen who are muslim, jew, buddhist, etc.

aer these "saved" becasue ther sinmply were "honest businesmen"

of course not.


see, you are trying to use yeshua for gains in this life, and its not possible alatho many are fooled into bleeving that it is.

agian, i tell you, the earth is satans kingdom not yeshuas

so yeshua can only save your soul here, not your matierial life.


is he could, then why did all the martyrs die?

why didnt jesus help them escape death?

was it just a 'business decision'??


of course not, because until jesus returns, satan has dominion on this planet.

but you are free to bleef otherwise.

sopsback said...

and look, i bleefed in the dg process myslef.


and i think that all involved kurt, dr. fred et al are all goood guys


havings said that, we may have differtne intrepretations of the biblbe verses and in history, even the best of them did

not all the great theelogian agreee on evertyihgn...look at marty looter...wah hoppens to him??

sopsback said...

Sept. 1, 2009

Russian Professor Igor Panarin says that events are continuing to confirm his doomsday prediction first made over 10 years ago, that the United States will completely collapse like the Soviet Union before the end of 2010, and warns that the chaos could begin to unfold in as little as two months.






so much for the peace and propensity paks for prosperity....??????

taycamstu said...

Is there any stopping sopsback? Or chance of getting him spellcheck?

sopsback said...

another proof taht jesus is not interested in business but only salvation.


ROMANS 8:28

"FOR WE KNOW THAT ALL THINGS MUST WORK TOGETHER FOR GOOD, FOR OUR SALVATION TO THOSE WHO LOVE HIM AND ARE CALLED ACCORDING TO HIS PURPOSE"



so the key element here is SALVATION


which means that things to you that appear to be "good' or "bad" are really irrelevatn- it ALL works for GOOD to get you saved.


which then for ex. as hard as it is to bleef, then even judge allsop what he did workd toghter for good for salvation.

for SALVATION

NOT GOOD FOR GETTING PPLS MTGS PAID, OR THEIR HOUSE BACK OR FOR KURT, OR DR. FRED OR ME OR YOU

BUT


FOR SALVATION

DIFFICULT CONCEPT TO UNDERSTAND FOR MOST


NOW WOULD I REFUSE MY MTG GETTING PAID?

OF COURSE NOT!

BUT THATS NTO THE POINT

THE POINT IS THAT JESUS IS ONLY CONCERNED WITH SALVATION.

IF YOU MTG GETS PAID, BUT YOU GO TO DAMNATION, THING THAT JESUS CARES ABOUT THAT???????

NADA.


but if your saved, then it really doesnt matter if yuor out on the street becaseu iits about your next life,not this one.

sopsback said...

othewies, why is heaven soooo good but noone wants to go there???


i mean if you tell me about a place i like i want to go there like now, not a year from now or 30 or 60 years from now.

so why isnt everyone lining up to die to get to heaven but insted try to prolong their life as long as possible.

something about thqat doesnt make any sense?


haven is soo good, yet noone rushes to get there

sopsback said...

ANS.


either heaven is not so good, or we dont bleef waht jesus say about it.

WHICH IS IT????

sopsback said...

Is there any stopping sopsback? Or chance of getting him spellcheck?


its not about stopping slop, its about not being able to stop the truth of the HS..its unsloppable

sopsback said...

the truth of the HS is like WD-40.....IT PENETRATES

sopsback said...

i think that kendy has the right idea regarding thsi stuff.


its about knowing WHO you are: a child of god

now will you notice, that ALTHO this is satans kingdom, and he rules over it, the earth is gods planet.


you are a child on gods planet even tho satan rules it. he does ;not own the earath, god does and if you knwo who you are, you can live on it as a trustee for god.


sort of simular to yopu live in you house, altho tech speaking, the county owns it thru taxes. but you live in harmony even tho you technically dont own it.


also like even the slaves under faro, farrow owned the salves, but fairo didnt own the earth under his/there feet; god did.


god owns satan and for now, until jesus come back, he tole satan to go play in gods sandbox, the erth. and we are like the palstic gi joes in the sandbox. he can maipualte them around but cannot alter the souls of those god has secure before there molds were cast...or other words, 'perdestined beefo the fundations of the erth"

sopsback said...

FOR THOSE WHOM HE FOREKNEW BEFORE THE FOUNDATIONS OF THE EARTH,

HE PREDESTINED

THOSE WHOM HE PREDESTINED

HE ALSO CALLED

THOSE WHOM HE CALLED

HE ALSO JUSTIFIED


THOSE WHOM HE JUSTFIED

HE ALSO GLORIFIED

sopsback said...

FOR THOSE WHOM HE FOREKNEW BEFORE THE FOUNDATIONS OF THE EARTH,


god alredy no you even before he pick up the sand at the beach to fill his sandbox (earth)



HE PREDESTINED


and those whom he knew, he already know where they wer gong to, their destination



HE ALSO CALLED


like when joe torre pick up the phone to the bullpen for reeleef pitcha

did yo get the call??

or was the line busy? ;-(

at&t "sorry, yo call did not go thru, pleese check yo number and dial again"


THOSE WHOM HE CALLED

HE ALSO JUSTIFIED


he made these 'righteous' before god thte father. no matter what these do, they get a pass as noone on earth can judge these, they got the ticket


THOSE WHOM HE JUSTFIED

HE ALSO GLORIFIED


these will be glorified to the father in heaven

(and on earth as saints well at teh second coming given the power to judge evil "on the sopt"

warned: "yo do evil, yo gone. nqa" (no questons aksed) saints will have power to judge evil in the real millenail kingdom