Wednesday, September 06, 2006

Class in Session: Lesson 2

There are 5 responses possible in commerce that circle around honesty and fair dealing. 3 of these responses are honorable and 2 dishonorable. Let’s go back to the pallet of eggs example for reference. The invoice for eggs not delivered arrives. The honorable response of full acceptance could look like this: Invoice $3,000.00

Full Acceptance: I paid your invoice, verify delivery I don’t believe I received them. Thanks.
Notice there is no kink in the remedy, I am honest and trust you are.

Conditional Acceptance: I will pay this upon proof of delivery I don’t believe I received them.
Again this is honest and streamlines the problem and solution. Business remains greased.

Acceptance Denied for Cause Without Dishonor: I didn’t order eggs from you or receive them. I’ve returned your invoice.
Additional comment is not necessary if there is no custom or standard of business between you. The invoice is from a stranger. This is why we had to become trustees and chose-in-action in your case or we had no custom or standard of business with the bank and they could refuse justly.

Argument: Anyone who grew up with siblings, parents, been married or gone to court even by TV knows what this is. It is a dishonor. It could look like this “those weren’t the eggs I ordered, I didn’t receive them, I don’t owe you a penny, I told you I wasn’t going to do business with you again. If you don’t like it see my lawyer.
You can see all the controversy and resistance to business. The UCC can be used to avoid these hassles and keep things moving for you even if you run into someone dishonest.

Silence: This is the most common response of a society of ostriches who put their head in the sand and hope the problem goes away. The lack of communication kills business, which cannot be tolerated. The UCC provides remedy for dishonor towards the more honest player. The best player wins monopoly not the most honest. Don’t get the UCC mixed up with holy ethics. That it is not!

117 comments:

tcob247 said...

hold on to your eggs Kurt

surfer said...

How did Court go yesterday?

son of a prophet said...

true/flase??

in UCC an unanswered affidavit stands as truth??

dejavu said...
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dejavu said...
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dejavu said...
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dejavu said...
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dejavu said...

"In UCC an unanswered affidavit stands as truth??"

yes, as long as nobody answers it, it stands as truth.

newgurl said...

what happened in court...anyone? neo?

Tony Tuba said...

As you can see, I'm posting a lot today.

dejavu said...

comment deleted:

please continue.

Al Carrozzo said...

Is there a wayto communicate privately and directly to clients-etc.?

kaz4541 said...

so, what happened yesterday at the court??? is this done yet?

Tony Tuba said...

This post has been removed by the author.

Tony Tuba said...

Two Wongs don't make a Wright. They make a Wong.

This post has been removed by the author said...

Comment deleted.

This post has been removed by the author said...

"How did Court go yesterday?"

It went fine.

How did it go for you?

ricco7777 said...

Has anyone out there that had to sell their home? How difficult was it to get the title company to accept the quit claim deed that put the house back into your name from the trust? The title company is making it very difficult on me. ANY input would be appreciated!
Thanks!
Ricco

This post has been removed by the author said...

What is the title company saying is wrong with your quit claim deed?

laughing lots said...

Ricco--
Please man dont ask these guys stuff like that, you will want to hang yourself.
Do yourself a favor go talk to an attorney.
DONT ask these brain washed,
wanna be's anything about titles, god lord man.
If they could have it their way they would have clouded titles and borrowed money on it. Do you think that kurt, scott or any of their mindless followers really care if joe blow has a mortgage that they owe money on? ABSOLUTLEY NOT!!!!
They only care about borrowing money on the title and getting money from it.
They want to get rich quick. They can deny it all they want on here but they REALLY know whats going on, DONT YOU?
And to the ones who are wondering what happened in court, well lets just say that their still IN JAIL.
Does that shock anyone?
HAhahahahahahahahaha
MORONS!!!!!!!!!!!!

KYHOOYA said...

ricco7777 said...
Has anyone out there that had to sell their home? How difficult was it to get the title company to accept the quit claim deed that put the house back into your name from the trust? The title company is making it very difficult on me. ANY input would be appreciated!
Thanks!
Ricco

If it were me I would tell the broker (If you used one )to talk to the title company and tell them to get on with it.

If you are acting agent with the bank and the title is giving you grief I would ask them to spell out in wriyting what they are asking for and exactly what it is that they are finding to be not insurable about the title. If the title is granted by the quick claim deed to you then then it is what it is and the title co. should have no problems with Issuance of the policy for lender. It would on the other hand seems to me that if there is no known problem ass of the title search with regard to the who is granted the title (This being the case with the QCD) showing something else in the mix as a possible contentment, then it would go to reason that the title is clear and you are owner.
1. you were the owner in 2003
2. then the Dorean trustees were placed on
3. then the trustees QCD title back to you.
There being nothing more than what I have listed above showing on the title search (and there being a pain I would ask to see the completed search with anything highlighted that they claim is a problem if this is the case)
I would ask that the explain how and what they deem to be the risk to title spelled out in writing
I bet is they are being a pain in the ass just because it show’s that it was in the Dorean group and for no other reasons and in fact are trying to use it to junk … excuse me .. Jack up the fees on there end of the deal on top of it all there actions if indeed they are not on the up & up then they will not put them in writing for fear of you taking it to the state reg. and suing them . If in fact they are willing to put in writing the exact cause for there alarm then you have something to work with and not just a

“Well we don’t like it that you went and tried and any legal remedies that the UCC has to go after our friends the BANKS “ “I mean come on , do you know how much $$$$ that the Banks feed us? It’s so much money that if it wasn’t for the fact that they cause the customer to use us to get there loan we wouldn’t be able to stay in business.” “ The fact is we don’t care what the customer wants or requests of us we work (most likely are owned by the Bank in the first place) like maybe that since they just closed a load there by having a title search done a year ago and want us to reduce the cost for the title insurance because of that risk and work needed to follow through with the issuance title insurance policy would be much less that normal” “ We just don’t think it would sit well with us if we didn’t make it a real pain in your ass in a show of are support for the banks and there by the continuance of there direction of YOU to are Door.” “ I mean come on, do you know how much money they bring us by there insistence that the customer (That would be you) use us for the completion of there funding the load?” “Now I don’t want to you to think that we will ever admit any of this in public the working and goings on are very hush hush in this business and if we were to cause trouble and say the wrong thing” “The loan business is a very closed mouth one when it comes to the how too and such, you better believe me.” “ Hey but between you and us ASS HOLES! That’s is exactly the way it go.” “ I been told once that someone at a brokers office was heard to say “” That we’ve got them in our pocket so don’t worry you’ll get the fund that you want even if the lenders said they wanted them to go else where , trust me I do this all the time”” (NOTE: If you haven’t got it the above is the title officer talking. Just wanted to make that clear for the stupefied that seem to have a big problem understanding my post’s & need the extra info to get the point so were here to help al we can so that they can kiss our ass!)

It’s an outrages amount of $$MONEY$$ they make and it is all brought to them by your friendly nationhood Bankers and the network of thieves they work with .The fact of the matter is that most likely the title is doing the latter and just being a bunch of prick about this to try and make some point . but who knows if they have something they should have know problem spelling out what exactly it is and why they are have the issue . also they should include any thought about what would be needed to correct the issue and clear the title for the issuance of the policy or step down and say they won’t issue it.

Again my bet is they won’t put shit in writing because to do so would be to cut there own throat if there is something going on that isn’t right & by the letter of the law.

You have a few chooses here
1. They put it in writing and you find out exactly what is needed to clear and any cost that they will add to the normal to do so. At witch point you can make that chose Ye or Nay base on the over all personals around it

2. You find they won’t put it in writing and that would mean that they are full of shit and I would tell them to get on with issuing of the policy or you will bring it to the state regulator and the State Attorney Generals office the facts about there actions and let them work out if they think there doing the right thing or not. Again my bet is there fucking with you just to be ass holes and because they think they can get away with it and some more of your money to boot They are regulated by the state at least in Ca, they are and most of the others that I know of are as well. They do have to carry insurance as trustees they have a responsibility to carry out in there duties and they need to do so by the laws set forth not there personal feelings and not if there is not documents to back up there claim of non insurability if this be the case there are other charges that could be filed if the finds there actions to be out of normal then you would have no problem going after them for damages in court and bring claim against there insurance as recovery (in other word’s you would have no problem collecting on a court verdict of damager in your favor as there would be plenty of insurance money to be had . Know having to fine the money to pay you it’s there and i8f the attorney has a problem with them there done to boot.

3. You tell them to get fuck and you get another title company to the work there is nothing saying that you have to use that title company and in fact there is plenty in the hand booklet that they gov hands out that will say that you have every right to use any one you want as title as long as they are lic. and fall under that needed to do such as a matter of fact you can use a lawyer to do title if you want it may be cheaper that that of a title company but you need to check the cost factor your self as I’m sure you aware of .


That’s about it and all I have for you in my eye’s it should be not a problem or issue whit the title company and if it is they better be able to back up what there saying or pay the cost of not doing so and being the ass holes they can be.
I see that old SEEN IT up your Ass in Utah has rushed to the aid of someone in need of info in the form of witch he could provide here. Like I said everyone of them SNAKES out for there own enrichment and the rest can fuck them self s for all they care. It would be to much to ask that they stop for a moment what ever or whom ever there in the process of screwing and take the time to help out someone else without getting some kinds a $$$ comp. For it. Yep that would be to dame much time and most likely eat into all that time they need to post around site's like neo's service they do and how all these people are just crazy about the banks doing thing wrong. O.K. I ‘all get going again so I stop here . tell them to perform or get fuck and that your going to report them for un businesslike practices to the state AG and just see what they do then. What do you have to lose they can’t and after that comment most likely won’t try to do anything that might get them in hot with regards to your insurance and the close of the deal.
They would be out of there minds or they just made the chose yesterday that they want to close up shop . Try it and see what happens let me know I would love to hear the end results of how thing went. Last thing as I started the fact is if your using a broker then make him do the work and be the bad guy here if he wants to get paid tell him to talk to the title company and work it out with out it costng you a arm and leg more to get it done. He should have a working rep. With them any way or should I say a crooked working agreement with them ..

Good luck ! Don’t let these guys push you around , just like a school playground bully,
\Most of the time you push them back and the fall back and leave you alone same goes here push back and let them know that you are aware of your right and who to go to and have them enforced and watch how the fall back and start to get it done, and quit messing with you.


Again Good Luck to you hope it work out and you close sooner rather than later. Boy I do go on don’t I sorry just seems that what it take to say what I want. Ask the others around here they’ll tell you that’s how it is forin us unaedmucation kind . LOL Hahahaha !
My sick hummer I guess

......… /--------*
qB^)>|=====\/

Sometimes in life even thought you put the time and effort into get something to hit the right spot , That’s just hen the dam string brakes and your left with what to do throw it away after all that time or tie a knot in it and keep going.

If you ever had one you might get a laugh .

laughing lots said...

kyhooya, you numnut!
Are you insane giving someone advice? Your lucky that YOU arent in prison with your mentally retarded friends, but who know's what the future holds.
You dorean wanna be freak!

Higuys said...

Those wishing to regain title see WWW.usdoj.gov/usao/can
Go to Press release (left column)
See July 27, 2006 Court Order

tcob247 said...

kahooya.........

"Sometimes in life even thought you put the time and effort into get something to hit the right spot , That’s just hen the dam string brakes and your left with what to do throw it away after all that time or tie a knot in it and keep going."


WHAT??????
Translation please.

"If it were me I would tell the broker (If you used one )to talk to the title company and tell them to get on with it."

WOW great advice
Have YOU had to untangle yourself from the Dorean mess?

NO

Rico,

The title company I worked with wanted KURT (dumbass) and Scott (dumberass) removed as the TRUSTEES of your TRUST

Paragraph 7.15 of ARTICLE VII allows you to do this.

An Attorney drafted it for me and was sent to the Title Company and everything went through OK

The Attorney said it was one of the worst Trusts he has ever seen

KYHOOYA said...

i SEE THAT lONLY OLD lOONY AKA lol IS OFFERING UP HIS WORTHLESS ADVISE WITHOUT ANY REAL HELP IN IT.

tHAT'S NICE TELL THE GUY TO GO SPEND MORE MONEY IT SOUNDS LIKE HE MIGHT NOT HAVE ON A LAWYER TO FIX SOMETHING THAT IS MORE THAN LIKLY ONLY THE TITLE COMPANY TRYING TO PUSH HIM AROUND AND GET MORE MONEY OUT OF THE DEAYOUR SUCH AN ASS HOLE MUST BE A BROKER, BANKER OR TITLE OFFICER IS MY GUESS ALONG WITH HEAD PICK AT THE BE ALL THE DICK YOU CAN BE CONVENTION (THat's for you there TIN CUP don't want yyou to feel you have to usewhat you call a brain and come up with another one of those great... Bha!ha! LOL one liners about gays again ) there just so dam witty are you sure that you arn't a comedian instead of a bum that beg's at the freeway off ramp , That is when your not here post that crap your so well known for.

You I bet I know what it is that makes you all that money you say you have (You know the $12,000.00 a month you said along with that great example of anything but what a pay check would look like as proof. Ha! Ha! Ha! Can you hear you son laughing at you half way arounde the world because I sure can! What a joke you are ! What a fucking joke, why don't you run along now and get back to making all that money as that FREEWAY OFF RAMP BEGGER. Thats all I can think of that might make you that kind of money for real dude tell me how did you get in to that kinda work any way?

OH never mind I forgot for second IT'S NOT WORK IT'S A BUM THAT BEGS FOR MONEY

never mind

And you LOL your a lot like that little piece of shit that sticks th the side of the cheek of you ass , you try and try to sshke it off but it just wont fall. So you try and wipe it with another piece of paper but that sticks to it and won't come off so there you sit with this piece of shit smered paper and your late and it dose'nt look like it going to fall off any time soon so you have a chose either pull up your pants and have a piece of shit stuck to you all day or

be a man and use you hand so you can flush that piece of shit down the drain where he ... I mean it ...know I had it right the first time .. where he belongs.

I was just wondering if you have evr had that problem you know! Being a sticky piece of shit smered paper stuck to the ass of someone cause you look like you might just have the expertise in that arena/..


Thank and i been Rosana Rosanadana with you your how to's get rid of a sticky shity problem good night all and remember don't try and follow SHITY ADVISE cus all it will get you is a stinky messy problem that your going to have to get your hands dirty over to get it flush and off you.


LOL your ass hole and i hope you get nothing but what you dish out you fucking title company ass hole no problem right nothing init for you is there? right! and where is it that most of the work form a title company comes from ... Oh thats right it the FUCKING BANKERS OH THAT EXPLAINS IT ALL NOW YOU COULD'NT HAVE ANY PROBLEM WITH ANYTHING THAT MIGHT SHUT DOWN THE BIGGEST PART OF THE MONEY YOU MAKE NOW COULD YOU MR. TITLE MAN?


Hey I have an idea for you why don't you .... (and I'll try and say this real slow so you can under stand what it is that I'm trying to say ... o.k. ...) why don't you spend some time today and see if you can get that pea brain of you to work long enough to come up with a new posting name and the put that to gether with a feww one line worthless coments to post and come back tomorrow as a hole new ASS HOLE WHO might get some respect fro about an hour intill everyone figures out you just that samer old as hole wheather you seen it in Utah or some where else it all the same piece of s.........t



l8r drip!


Oh by the way great advise how about maybe he should just give it all away for ever having thought to take a stand against the banks that are ripping him off and hey when you van come up with a real answer to this then you might just be getting it right .

Why on a refi is it that the EQ loan on the EQ in your house that in my case at this time would be somewhere inthe $400.000.00 range thats the diff from when I bought at 117,000.000 and now what it worth $$575,000.00++ so when I go and want a loan on the EQ that I have in my house and not a loan to buy a new house but an EQ loan why is it that the terms are different then when I want to get aloan on my 401K acct. that I have? I would love to hear your brake down on that if you now and yopu to there P girl you have answered alot of question around this one but never realy hit the question that I am asking so it's open but most of all I would love to hear your LOL be case your such a big smart guy about all the goings on in this business you should have no problem with it ..

My bet is that you'll come back with anything but an answer to it most likly somw side step bull shit that never even come close to evn toughing it

Seems like it an EZZZ one to me if the banking is so up an up than it should be EZZZ to explain away any dam question put out never mind one that is so basic as this one is

again diffeence between a 401K loan and it term and the one that a bank give you on a EQ based loan on you home with lots of biult EQ in it and never come close to even 75% LTV so I'm all ears


show me and all how smart you are it's a simple ????????/


bet you can answer it Straight without all the b.s. to cover up the fact that there nothing you have worth saying can you ?

or hey heres you op. to shin give it your best and then you don't have to go and spen all that time thinking up a newe name to post under you can hole you head high ... wel as higha as a snake can hold it up any way..


Ha hahahahaha !

Drip

tcob247 said...

wow...you are good

I got so tired trying to read past all the shit quotes you had and trying to decipher what you said that quite frankly I just gave up.

Did you really think I was going to send you a copy of my paycheck so you could see all my info?

I sent you a statement dillweed.

As far as my son in Iraq laughing?

He was recently home for a two week leave. The only laughing he did was looking at your posts.

I'm sure Rico feels better now that you have responded on how I took care of MY situation with Dorean.

I'm sure he will take YOUR advice.

(oh thats right, you are not and never were a Dorean client, my bad)

oksurewhynot said...

INSTEAD OF NEWS OF COURT HAPPENINGS, WE GET "Class in Session: Lesson 2".

We've had enough lessons, and come to think of it, we could even just say, "we've had enough."

tcob247 said...

Oh by the way kamensa

You said you have proof and can back up your 142 IQ

Where is it?

It sure isn't in your posts

This post has been removed by the author said...

I had a dream last night that scott and kurt got out of jail.
I don't know if that means anything but I just thought I'd tell yall.

tcob247 said...

This post has been removed by the author said...
I had a dream last night that scott and kurt got out of jail.
I don't know if that means anything but I just thought I'd tell yall.


If it happened it must be true
You are now a prophet

Leslie Neilsen said...

For those wondering how it went in court on the 5th.
An unnamed source has conveyed that the plaintiffs used the "Gary Coleman Defense" When the judge(William Alsup) read the charges filed against the Dorean principals as well as the brokers, Kurt simply approached the the bench and exclaimed "What chu talkin bout Willis". This unfortunately had no effect on judge Alsup. Stay tuned.

Seen it in Utah said...

Ricco: There are some hurdes to deal with on clearing your title. Tha last one I was given was clearly done illegally, as the purported signatures of the dim duo were notarized in Arizona when the dim duo were still in jail. I am in the process of trying to work things through with the title underwriter to get corrected documentation. The title underwriter will probably also request some affidavit type documentation that states that the parties trying to clear their title will indemnify the underwriter and title company for any subsequent issues that may arise later resulting from the fraudulent attempt to scrow the mortgage company and title companies.

The title companies and underwriters are taking it on a case-by-case basis. If you really do want to clear things up, make sure that your quit-claim deed is actually notarized in California by a notary that actually witnessed the signatures of Heineman and Johnson. Otherwise there could be a claim later that the deeds were bogus.

You will also have to prepare to acknowledge the error of your ways. As one of our underwriting counsel pointed out--the people trying to clear up their titles now are the same people that were trying to screw the mortgage companies and title companies--and their is a legitimate question as to whether they are honorable people or if they are scam artists or just victims. You will probably need to make a convincing case that you were a dupe rather than a scammer in order to really make it work. The other option, of course, is to file a quiet-title action in court and have a judge make a judicial order putting title back to where it was before you did the dirty deeds.

tcob247 said...

or you can follow Kahooya's advice

""If it were me I would tell the broker to talk to the title company and tell them to get on with it."

This post has been removed by the author said...

Leslie Neilsen:

What is a "Gary Coleman Defense"?

and, w

who is "Willis"?

Leslie Neilsen said...

post removed by author said,

What is a "Gary Coleman Defense"?

and, w

who is "Willis"?



Come on you can't be that ignorant. Surely you gest, and please don't call me Shirly

mogel said...

Ricco: Why not use a different title company? If they don't want your business, that's their problem. Has the title company defined the problem that they have?

This post has been removed by the author said...

I am that igorant Leslie. What is a Gary Coleman Defense and what is a Willie?

mogel said...

Seen it in Utah said: "The title underwriter will probably also request some affidavit type documentation that states that the parties trying to clear their title will indemnify the underwriter and title company for any subsequent issues that may arise later resulting from the fraudulent attempt to screw the mortgage company and title companies."
_______________________________
So the client is NOW expected to act as an insurance company now BY GUARANTEEING AN INDEMNIFICATION to the underwriter or insurance company? Hmmmm. I wonder if the client doing that could be construed as INSURANCE FRAUD in the State of Utah, acting as a surety or bonding agent without having having a valid insurance license? Such a claim wouldn't be any more ridiculous than the original insurance fraud claims in Utah against Scott & Kurt which by the way were dropped or never pursued.

Also, you are suggesting that the client also needs to offer evidence against himself (despite the 5th amendment in the constitution) that the client HAS SCREWED THE LENDER? Now that's real funny. Even a stupid client wouldn't do that.

As for the claim that the quit claim deed notarized in Arizona is fraudulent, what evidence do you have of that? If the trustees(Kurt & Scott) granted power of attorney to someone else in Arizona before they were imprisoned, and before any court order/injunction, that doesn't make the documents fraudulent, since the designee in Arizona would have full authority to act as agent or power of attorney. Sounds like you don't have your facts straight again, but that's nothing new.

Course who would want to get advise from you when you offer to incriminate a client, and offer him to sell himself short by forcing the client to admit to a criminal act and also offer a client to put potential liability on himself when the client BELIEVES DIFFERENTLY.

What a great example of how the title company doesn't want to do their job of insuring title & don't want to take any risk whatsoever, but wants to be paid a premium for it anyway.

habakkuk said...

Gary Coleman is an actor from the show "Different Strokes" back in the late 70's early 80's.....His famous saying to his brother "Willis" was "what you talkin bout Willis??"

.....i cant believe i answered that question on the mortgage fraud blog....for goodness sakes.

This post has been removed by the author said...

".....i cant believe i answered that question on the mortgage fraud blog....for goodness sakes."


anything goes over here, habak. Or haven't you noticed...for goodness sakes?

Tony Tuba said...

This post has been removed by the author said...

What is a Willie?






It's sometimes known as a "Johnson" or "Mr. Happy"

~~The Swami~~~ said...

My sister in law got a new kitten yesterday. I told her she should name her "Shaved". I'll keep everyone on the blog informed if she does end up with a "Shaved" pussy.

~~The Swami~~~ said...

laughing lots said...

..your mentally retarded friends...






I'm mentally retarded Mister! Thank you very much!!!!!!

I have a deck on my double wide too!!!!!

kaz4541 said...

so does anyone know or is anyone going to tell us what happened at the court on 5th??

Leslie Neilsen said...

kaz4541 said,

so does anyone know or is anyone going to tell us what happened at the court on 5th??


In this case no news is bad news.
If it were good it would have been relayed to the blog

Leslie Neilsen said...

Adolph Hitler's favorite joke.

"Zer ver two peanuts valking down zei strasse, und von vus assaulted......peanut." Ha ha zat vus ein gut one, ya?

This post has been removed by the author said...

Yeah, and my brother in law got a new weiner dog yesterday. I told him he should name him "Dinger". I'll keep everyone on the blog informed if she does end up naming him "Dinger."

habakkuk said...

It seems the court jesters have taken over the blog. Is there anyone left with ligitemate comments??

tcob247 said...

you mean Kahooyas comments arent legitimate?

I'm appalled

Kurt,
When will we receive lesson #3 ?

laughing lots said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
laughing lots said...

kyhooya the retard said:
And you LOL your a lot like that little piece of shit that sticks th the side of the cheek of you ass , you try and try to sshke it off but it just wont fall. So you try and wipe it with another piece of paper but that sticks to it and won't come off so there you sit with this piece of shit smered paper and your late and it dose'nt look like it going to fall off any time soon so you have a chose either pull up your pants and have a piece of shit stuck to you all day
___________________________________

Does anyone here speak caveman?
Because i cant understand one word that comes out of this retards mouth. You have got to be one of the most ignorant human beings, made by the hand of god!
I cant imagine one single sane person listening to one word that comes out of your illiterate mouth.
You make me laugh so hard that its unreal.
Your nothing but retarded white trash and anyone who takes your advice should be put into an insane asylum.

comebackfromfantasyland said...

class in session: Lesson 3

now class when kurt posts things like "this will all be over by august" and you have been suffering all this time and lost your house and had your hopes dashed yet again, learn that you have to weigh that with all of the other empty predictions of timelines and understand it is not wise to continue in that manner after the first 18 times of being incorrect.

I suspect most of you already have except one, so class is over.

provb1022 said...

It seems the court jesters have taken over the blog. Is there anyone left with ligitemate comments??

_______

The trial will be in Jan.

Pauligirl said...

filed September 6, 2006
ORDER OF REFERENCE
This matter is hereby REFERRED to MAGISTRATE JUDGE JOSEPH C. SPERO for
MEDIATION/SETTLEMENT pursuant to Rule 11.1.
IT IS SO ORDERED.

Dated: September 6, 2006.
Signed by Judge Alsup

Filed today.....
William Kubitz (the camp Admin from the Dublin facilities), the fella that H & J tried to appoint as their attorney, filed a declaration. Simply put, it says I'm not an attorney, I'm not their attorney, and I've never discussed legal matters with them. He goes on to say that he received a letter mailed by "Dr. Fred" signed by H & J "regarding legal strategy and directions for locating a document for a "sight draft" to be used for financial settlement in their case."

The letter is attached to the Declaration and goes on to state "If you intend on settlement, Mr. Johnson will immediately endorse the printed instrument upon your request. If your legal determination are different, we will trust your wisdom. "



P
to see the filings
http://paulag.home.coastalnet.
com/order%20of%20reference.pdf

http://paulag.home.coastalnet.
com/kubitz%20declaration.pdf

http://paulag.home.coastalnet.
com/kubitz%20exhibit.pdf

newgurl said...

the links didnt work for me.

What does that order mean Pauligirl? the trial or just the motion?

Pauligirl said...

newgurl said...
the links didnt work for me.

What does that order mean Pauligirl? the trial or just the motion?

6:05 PM
----------------
I'm not sure. I'd guess that J & H have requested to settle, but that letter in Kubitz's Declaration indicated that they wanted to pay the settlement with a sight draft.

You have to copy and paste the links into your browser in 2 steps.
P

tcob247 said...

OHHHH MYYYYY GODDDD

I cannot believe what I read in those filings

I am laughing my fricking ass off

Those two are so stupid

And Dr Fred's written letter...

What a fricking joke

Please somebody help me stop laughing

This was THE BIG EVENT

LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL

They need to serve 30 years for stupidity

Fire up the grill IMBGIO

son of a prophet said...

i know of someone that has a case that attorneys wont touch because they are afraid of a "rule 11" sanction; it seems that they are afraid of rule 11 that a judge will make them pay the opposing attorney fees for a so called frivoluous lawsuit.



?????


is the judge about to make the govt. pay for bringing a frivoulus lawsuit against H & J????

Pauligirl said...

son of a prophet said...
i know of someone that has a case that attorneys wont touch because they are afraid of a "rule 11" sanction; it seems that they are afraid of rule 11 that a judge will make them pay the opposing attorney fees for a so called frivoluous lawsuit.



?????


is the judge about to make the govt. pay for bringing a frivoulus lawsuit against H & J????

-----------------------
I doubt that's it. According to the Order, it's for "MEDIATION/SETTLEMENT pursuant to Rule 11.1." You are talking about Federal Rules. In CA Local rules: RULE ELEVEN:

Arbitration And Settlement Conferences In Civil Cases

11.1 Policy:

All civil cases, except for those described in Rule 1600.5 of the California Rules of Court, shall be subject to mandatory judicial arbitration. Said arbitration shall be governed by Code of Civil Procedure § 1141.11 et seq. and the applicable California Rules of Court unless otherwise set forth herein. The provisions of Rule 1600, subdivisions (a) and (b) and Rule 1601 are adopted subject to the further provisions of these rules. The provisions of Rule 1601, subdivision (c)(1), shall also apply to actions filed in the municipal court.

Which sounds more like what Alsup was doing.

Does anybody here know Californa law?
P

Pauligirl said...

tcob247 said...
--------------------------------
You read the letter. The second line is obliterated by the court filing stamp. What do you think it said? I have an idea, but I want another opinion.

Thanks
P

tcob247 said...

we have no idea what your legal ______ might be......

I can't figure out that last word

Pauligirl said...

tcob247 said...
we have no idea what your legal ______ might be......

I can't figure out that last word

--------------
Got it. "strategies". For some reason, copy and paste will leave off the court overlay.
Thanks
P

justice77777777 said...

legal determination

newgurl said...

ok, H&J are trusters for their strawmans NAME, and being their holders in due course of said property they are trying to settle any damages to govt. with a sight draft financial offset and release the matter as satisfied in full of any and all claims.
perhaps this is what all the denied guilty motions included, just speculation.

this should be interesting

GR82BMOI said...

Clearly, there is only one legal mind, (outside the U.S. prison system, of course) qualified to comment on the latest goofy strategy of the dim duo…

(attempting to appoint the Prison Jail and Camp Administrator legal counsel? Brilliant! Absolutely frickin’ brilliant!)

…and that would be…Mogel, obviously. Moogie? Where are you? Please entertain us all with your studied legal interpretation. Pretty please?

WillToFight said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
son of a prophet said...

is s**t about to hit fan?

all US checks to foreign banks will bounce



Wanta Confident $4.5 Trillion Will Be Released As Corrupt U.S.Authorities Backing Themselves Into A Corner
Ambassador Leo Wanta hoped the money would be released by Sept 7 but has "dropped the financial hammer," notifying major European banks of U.S. government's nonpayment. In turn banks are placing stop orders on all transactions with the U.S. government of $100 million or more. Further, U.S. Treasury does corrupt deal with Vietnam and Taiwan to delay Wanta payment.

By Greg Szymanski
8 Sept 2006

see site for rest of story.

son of a prophet said...

lol!


will USA now start to wrdite up sight drafts?

or maybe file a UCC finacing statement for they bounced chex?

heheheheheeeeeeeeeeeeee........

WillToFight said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
WillToFight said...

So the Case is now set for settlement and has become a "Civil" issue!

What happened to the "Criminal" issues?

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm?

Alsup refers this to a Magistrate?


Hmmmmmmmmm?

"Settlement" hmmmmmmmmm?

Very interesting?

SOP will the check from the goberment be any good?

hehehe!

laughing lots said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
son of a prophet said...

UCC© can be explained very easily with an example.....


someone says "hello" to you...

you reply... "if i reply to your 'hello', am i entering into a contract with you?"



no matter what anyone says, you can reply as above... "if i _______ , am i entering into a contract with you?"

to a policeman when asking for drivers license, id etc...

to irs when asking for tax info...

to a judge when asking for whatevfer...

to the govt. when asking _________ of you...

to _______ (fill-in) when asking for whatver.....


BE AWARE HOWEVER: that the ptb do not like you to use this newly found knowldge and will try to make you suffer for it and pay, as h and j are doing; so IF you decide to use it, be forewarned.

you will win in the long run, but it will come at a price.


AND IF by chance they say "yes, you are", then you are free to say that you decline to enter the contract with them.

and they cant say "no, you are not entering into a contract" because they know that you are if you
respond to them.



lol. ok, some funny things now....when a baby is born, if he could speak, could he ask him mom if by her letting him be born, that he is entering into a contract with his mom...the anser is YES, of course he is...the contract is that she will take care of him until he is 18 at least.

climax said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
kurt says there will be no trial said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
kurt says there will be no trial said...

.

tcob247 said...

Hello SOP

tcob247 said...

Chinese proverb:

Man who walk through turnstile sideways going to Bangkok

Trial Will Be in Jan said...

taco bell 24/7

yuk.

laughing lots said...

Hahahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!
This gets funnier everyday, my god!
Hey maybe next time you know the OTHER big date, they will assign Fred Flintstone as their attorney.
These guys are seriously mental.
ANYONE who looks up to these two retards needs to be put in jail with them on principle alone.
This is not surprising though.
Instead of them stating there so called LEGAL defense, this is the kind of shit that they do, and why?
Because they know they are doomed and they cannot prove their innocence. This is only a tactic to put off the inevitable, and it is INEVITABLE!

whatdoyoumean said...

LOL,

Go laugh somewhere else. Since when does anyone have to prove they are innocent????

It is supposed to be innocent until proven GUILTY. The burdon of proof lies with the accuser.

You are the most insulting clown here. Go away.

mogel said...

Retard said: "Because they know they are doomed and they cannot prove their innocence."
______________________________
It's the prosecutions obligation to prove fraud charges. It's not K&S 's duty or obligation to prove anything. If the prosecution can't prove their alleged fraud charges, the Defendants go free. This case will probably settle and there will be no trial.

You can't speak on what K&S know. You are heresay, irrelevant, extraneous, redundant, & retarded, all mixed up together into one incoherent thought.

god said...

He's a clueless little imp....just ignore him.

laughing lots said...

Your so brain washed, it's pathetic.
We will see loosers!
We will see.

laughing lots said...

And i am not going anywhere retard!

god said...

Thats ok, you can stick around and be our pet. Goooood boy Laughie, Gooooood boy:)

KYHOOYA said...

As seen said:


You will probably need to make a convincing case that you were a dupe rather than a scammer in order to really make it work. The other option, of course, is to file a quiet-title action in court and have a judge make a judicial order putting title back to where it was before you did the dirty deeds.

9:00 AM

-----------------------
So your saying that the customer has to belittle them self and as mogle said to incriminate them selfs in order fot the title company to write the policy for the lender?

If so then what more proof dose anyone need to show how the bank are running the title company and escrow companys. Are you sure they don't want them to stand in the corrner intill they show that they are really ,really sorry?
This is the most stupid thing I ever heard .

What in the name of God's green & Blue Planet is all that have to do with writing a title policy and the carring out of the banks instruction to close?

Oh you know what don't worry about it . I give up! You guys make this up as you go along and most of it is nothing more that what you would like it to be and no where near the truth . and the rest of the time you spend causeing everyone to waste there time going back and forth in your oh so clear distraction . You can't even answer the simplest of questions all you can do is try and side step it. all of you Tin Cup ,Utah , LOL NEO, are wothless and in as I see it offer nothing in the way of anything to anyone (Just a waste of space ) here and every where you are. You could'nt see beyond your own selfish & greed guided mind set to ever hear out understand something that is new or come to light. Your happy cheating and lying your way through or don't mind paying all that money to the banks beacuse theyt feed it back to you for a morgage .

Here I'll help all the ones who can't seem to put two rabbits together for an idea or thought inregard to the question I posted many time now .

The diff of the loan Rate & Terms of a home refi or EQ loan and a loan from your 401K plan.

1. Home EQ or Refi: The bank charges you 2/3 more for the life of the loan and all the interest goes to them.

Seems to me to be a bit out of proportion with a loan from your 401k

401K loan: most everything is the same in the paperwork ie: interest is charge time the repayment will be and pay ect. the diff. is that the interest that you pay goes back to you acct. and you don't have to pay some greedy banker the three times the amount you borrowed from your self .

The same statment can be said in the Refi & EQ ("your money and earned acct not something that you are asking for that is not your already) loan as in the 401K if it were that the banks wer'nt screwing you and doing so as something that just got sort of swept to the side when the differenyt kinds of loans started up ovet time. Because there is a big diff in a loan you want to Buy a home & that of a loan to tap the Earned EQ in that home. this is the same as the money earned on your 401k plan and should be treated as such.

Funny thing is that if the banks did it the way it should be then we all would'nt need 30 , 40 , now going on 50 year term to pay them back there fee for the work to monitize the note agreement and should be some where around the 15 -25 % ranger and would be a fine proft fore the work performed but nooooo! they want to get you for what is the equil to 200% over the life of therer loan terms..


Put simply you should be able to go to a place called a Neg inst. converter and pay them a set fee to convert youe note and promise to pay into FRN's and charge so fee to do so that would be in proportion to the work done and such.

Let me ask you this when you think of the ststement that we heard many time that the
"bank's is do some comp. for the time the money is used because it could have been makeing money someother way during that time"
Hey no kiding but lets look at the facts in it

1. It's not there money it's yours. The banks only take your signed note and then sell it for FRN and you use them and if you don't the owner don't live up to your agreement to paying them there fee's the funds are then reduced when the proporty is transfer by a change of title. The fact is the bank never get's the loss of any money (FRN's) use because it never had it to begain with Thats what they don't want to disclose at the time you sign your paper and note or why would they over look that little bit of info when there is so much that is put into disclosing of the working process and your right in this transactions papers in the first place? I'll help with that it is because they want to hide the fact about what they are doing to the note after you sign it and what there comp. there getting in return by selling you asset without telling you for FRN's,The fact that you have to sign over your and made the bank a trustee to your deed is a little extreme for the service that is being done and in fact they are in riching them selfs at you cost of EQ by doing it the way they do it (This would be only 1 of many resones why they don't want to tell you the hole truth and disclose all of the transaction)

2. The time would be shorter for repayment back to your acct & them, do to the fee being much smaller than the % that they are charging right now (or should I say steeling by hiding these thing from you at the time of signning so you can't choose what the true cost and value is for taking the advance in your EQ)

So if we are to understand the transaction in complet it would be that : you would go to a bank to get a % of the amount that your investment (HOME) has made for you with the idea that you were going to replace it back over a set time withe the interest that it would have qqueil to what the maket would have added to it over that time and the interest that you would have made in the market (the samething that they are saying when they say that there not going to have the use of that money so they are do compansation for what it could have made them)it is just that it's your money and so you should be paying your self back for the use and the time where it would be have been use as investment fund as in a 401k plan the interest get put back to you a small fee is pay from the Admin and when it's all said and done the bank has made money you have gotten the use of the fund in your acct for whatever (remember it was'nt that long ago when you had to give a real resone for the use of te money from a home EQ loan as in the case with a 401k loan and you could only get up to a set % of the acct. as in a home EQ loan). You see it is all to alike the two loans thething that isn't is the one item that makes the banks a landslide of money for nothing but watching time. the banks took what was a very simple idea and made itto a very misunderstood one for only one resone to get more of your money and alls they have to to keep it going is some easy simple thing that were thought up long ago they just have to tweck them every once and awile to ajust to todays why of thing and keep it going in there favor. It's EEEEZZZZZ when you comtrol the money of a country to convete it's system and laws to give you the most form it.


THe qoute from A.Jackson was right on the "money" (get it?) when he said that if we allow the banks to control the right of issuing money instead of by the people (congress) as "WE the people" had it put to paper for a resone in the first place.
If the country let's this happen then the bank care not what the peole or lawmaker say they can have it changre to there favor at any time by the pure power in witch they have been givin. The control of money is a powerful thing and can be the one thing that will make a good man do evil things.

I wonder how many out ther have at one point in there life been faced with the choose of steeling something wheather it be a piece of candy or a box of pens from work ECT. and when they did so if that was the case and in most I would have to beleive that they have at some point done this and when they did do it was the justifcation by why of the saying that "There was so much who will miss it" or "It's a big corp. they diserve it they screw peole all the time"
or was it just because it was there and you did'nt have it and wanted it.

All in all none being the right thing to do as I'm sure we can all aggree to , at least I hope we can .That being the case why would we think that just becaus ethe stakes are bigger and the one is the many that the temptaion is not there to take that money and power as in the banking system that we have inset for this country.
I can say for my self that thee is none they as in the big Enron theft for example is many out there that would find the power of the FED RES> BANKS and the system to easy to get over on and would take that chance and your money along the way .

Think about this for a second before you point your finger and say how could they or it just something made up in the movies . IT's not case when your being robbed that it is done in the middle of the sidewalk and with a gun most of the tome it's done by mean of undercover slow steady consumtion of somthing and before you know it one day you go out to get it or use it and geuss what
? Right it's not there , gone, vanished withot a trace.

Funny thing is that when you watch movies they sometime ...well wost of the time end up to have some base in the truth. You might want to look at the shows around and better yet you might want to just take a good look around and make sure someone isn't steeling you "us" BLIND ....

You know what all said and done and that is what I am here I will WISH ALL OF YOU EVERY SINGLE ONE EVEN YOU TCOB247 THAT YOU HAVE A WIND FALL OF GOOD FORTUNE COME YOUR WAY AND THAT YOU & YOUR'S ARE KEPT CLOSE , SAFE AND HAPPY FOR MANY YEARS TO COME. IN OTHER WORD


I WISH YOU ALL TO FIND YOUR LOOKING FOR BUT BETTER YET I HOPE YOU ALL FIND A HAPPY PLACE WHAT EVER THAT MAYBE FOR YOU .. WELL ONLY YOU KNOW. WHEN YOU DO, I HOPE THAT THE ONES YOU CARE ABOUT ARE THERE GREETING YOU AND CUS EVEN IF YOU DON'T GET ALL THE THING YOU WANT AND WISH FOR THROUGH LIFE IF YOU CAN IF A SPOT THAT THE ONES YOU LOVE ARE WITH YOU THAT A PLACE THAT ANYONE CAN BE HAPPY IN .

........GOOD LUCK! TO YOU ALL, i MEAN THAT IN ALL CINCERITY (HA HA!) I JUST HAD TO DO ONE LAST TIME FOR THE TEACHERS OUT THERE .

BUT SERIOUSLY NOW, FORM THE HEART I WISH YOU ALL THE BEST!

I'm outta here L8R..l
"Gone fishing"

z {}}}}}}{{{{{{
z /-------J }}}}{{{{{{{
dB^D>/x=====\/ }}}}}{{{
_________________________ Cuz it's gotta be a better way to spend the time than I have been here.

K.I.S.S= Keep it simple stupid !!!!!!

god said...

Laughie!?!!! (wistle) Laauuughieeee!!!!!!

god said...

LOL!!! LOL!!!

tcob247 said...

"You know what all said and done and that is what I am here I will WISH ALL OF YOU EVERY SINGLE ONE EVEN YOU TCOB247 THAT YOU HAVE A WIND FALL OF GOOD FORTUNE COME YOUR WAY AND THAT YOU & YOUR'S ARE KEPT CLOSE , SAFE AND HAPPY FOR MANY YEARS TO COME. IN OTHER WORD"

I am wiping a tear from my eye as I type

So you are never coming back?

Good luck to you there Kahooya

laughing lots said...

God you are so stupid huh? you think that bothers me?
Hahahahahahahahaha!
Its funny to me, please keep posting..

laughing lots said...

kyhooya we will miss all of your wonderful intelligent comments.
Hahahahahahahahahaha!
Bye,bye retard!

GR82BMOI said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
GR82BMOI said...

Mogel said…”This case will probably settle and there will be no trial.”

Yeah – they’ll woosie out and plea bargain 30 years instead of the lifetime they’re sure to get at the rate they’re going. Actually, I don’t think they’ve got “enough sense to come in out of the rain”, as my granddad always used to say. Evidently, those two stooges have some sort of penchant for the world’s-biggest-criminal-idiot title. But hey – everyone gets their 15 minutes of fame right?

Yetter said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Yetter said...

beam me up scotty, there is no intelligent life here.

son of a prophet said...

Former White House Chief Of Staff Andy Card's Cousin Released After Being Jailed for One Year For Having Information "No WMD Existed In Iraq."


A NY federal judge finally ruled and released Susan Lindauer, saying the government had no grounds to forciblly medicate her and keep her locked away.
9 Sep 2006

By Greg Szymanski



Political prisoner Susan Lindauer, held in a New York federal correctional facility for more than year under psychiatric evaluation, was released Friday after a federal court judge ruled the U.S. government had no legal grounds to keep Lindauer locked away.



Federal Judge D.J. Mukasey of the U.S. District Court, S.D. New York, ruled against the government's motion to keep Lindauer locked away under forced medication, saying "there is simply not enough here to warrant a finding by clear and convincing evidence that Lindauer is substantially likely to be rendered competent by forced medication and substantially unlikely to suffer effects that will impinge upon a fair trial."



Better late than never but after more than year of forced incarceration and unnecessary psychiatric evaluations and forced drugging, Lindauer walked away a free woman but still faces charges stemming from urging the U.S. government in March 2001 not to attack Iraq since it had no weapons of mass destruction.



She was released Friday from the MCC NEW YORK METROPOLITAN CORRECTIONAL CENTER, 150 PARK ROW, NEW YORK, NY, held under the inmate number of 56064-054.



Lindauer, 43, a former journalist and U.S. congressional aide, wrote a March 2001 letter to he cousin, Andrew Card, former White House Chief of Staff, saying an Iraqi delegation was urging the U.S. to send weapons inspectors into Iraq in order to avert war and prove categorically there existed no weapons of mass destruction.



According to observers close to the Lindauer case, the letter sparked on "all out attack," leading to charges still pending, including four counts with conspiring to act and acting as an unregistered agent of the government of Iraq, in particular the Iraq Intelligence Service ("IIS"), from October 1999 until February 2004, and engaging in various forbidden financial transactions with that government during that period, apparently in connection with her alleged role as agent of that government.



Lindauer denied involvement as an Iraqi agent who took payoffs totaling $10,000, saying she was just trying to "do the right thing" by alerting the government that she learned through credible sources that no WMD existed in Iraq, making the war unnecessary.



However, according to Lindauer and other observers, the Bush administration viewed her as a threat to the administration's illegal intentions of going to war with Iraq at all costs by lying to the American people about Iraq's nuclear capabilities.



Mark Bilk, a friend and activist following the case, said Lindauer first drew the ire of the Clinton and Bush administrations when, as a reporter, she uncovered evidence that Libyan terrorists were not behind a bomb that exploded aboard Pan Am flight 103 over Lockerbie, Scotland, killing 270 passengers and crew.



"She had information it wasn't Libyan terrorists as claimed by the U.S. and Israeli governments, but actually Syrians in complicity with the CIA who placed the bomb on the plane," said Bilk Friday on Greg Szymanski's radio show, The Investigative Journal, at 4-6pm central time on www.gcnlive.com



"She was essentially imprisoned for trying to do the right thing and alert her government of the facts she learned about Lockerbie and the fact there wasn't WMD in Iraq. Instead of listening, the Bush administration wanted her out of the picture, essentially labeling her as a terrorist."



Besides the Iraqi connection regarding sensitive WMD information, Lindauer became embroiled with former CIA agent, Dr. Richard Fuisz, who claimed Libya was not responsible for the Lockerbie bombing.



In 2000, a gag order was placed on Dr. Fuisz by the U.S. government under state secrecy laws,as he faced 10 years in prison if he revealed any information about the terrorist attack.



According to a Sunday Herald article one month before a court order was served on him by the US government gagging him from speaking on the grounds of national security, he spoke to US congressional aide Susan Lindauer, telling her he knew the identities of the Lockerbie bombers and claiming they were not Libyan.



The 2000 article, appearing in London but not here, went on to say:



"In her affidavit, she goes on: "DrFuisz has told me that he can identify who orchestrated and executed the bombing. Dr Fuisz has said that he can confirm absolutely that no Libyan national was involved in planning or executing the bombing of Pan Am 103, either in any technical or advisory capacity whatsoever."



"Fuisz's statements to Lindauer support the claims of the two Libyan accused who are to incriminate a number of terrorist organizations, including the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine-General Command, which had strong links to Syria and Iran."



The article went on to say that Lindauer said Fuisz told her he could provide information on Middle Eastern terrorists, and referred to Lockerbie as an "example of an unsolved bombing case that he said he has the immediate capability to resolve".



Lindauer also said that Fuisz told her CIA staff had destroyed reports he sent them on Lockerbie. Lindauer also refers in her affidavit to speculation that the USA shifted any connection to Lockerbie away from Syria to Libya in return for its support during the Gulf war.



"She added that Fuisz told her: "If the [US] government would let me, I could identify the men behind this attack today. I could do the right thing ... I could go into any crowded restaurant and pick out these men ... I can tell you their home addresses ... You won't find [them] anywhere in Libya. You will only find [them] in Damascus. I was investigating on the ground and I know."



The following is Judge Mukasey's full opinion on the Lindauer matter dated Sept. 6, 2006:



United States District Court,S.D. New York.



UNITED STATES of America



v.



Susan LINDAUER, a/k/a "Symbol Susan", Defendant.



No. S2 03 CR. 807(MBM).





Sept. 6, 2006.







Michael J. Garcia, Esq., United States Attorney for the Southern District of New York, Edward C. O'Callaghan, Esq., Assistant U.S. Attorney, New York.



Sanford Talkin, Esq., Talkin, Muccigrosso & Roberts L.L.P., New York.





OPINION AND ORDER



MUKASEY, D.J.



*1 Susan Lindauer is charged in four counts with conspiring to act and acting as an unregistered agent of the government of Iraq, in particular the Iraq Intelligence Service ("IIS"), from October 1999 until February 2004, and engaging in various forbidden financial transactions with that government during that period, apparently in connection with her alleged role as agent of that government. At least a half dozen mental health professionals, including a psychologist and a psychiatrist retained by the defense, and several psychologists and psychiatrists employed, and one psychiatrist retained, by the government, have found her mentally incompetent to stand trial, due principally to delusions of grandiosity and paranoia that make her unable to assist meaningfully in her own defense and understand the nature of the proceedings she faces. Defendant, but not her lawyer, has refused to accept the diagnosis and has refused to take psychotropic drugs that government physicians wish to administer in aid of rendering her competent to stand trial. The government has moved pursuant to Sell v. United States, 539 U.S. 166 (2003) for an order compelling administration of such drugs. Lindauer, through and with the approval of her lawyer, opposes the motion.





Sell is discussed at greater length below, but in summary it requires that in order to obtain such relief, the government show that important government interests are at stake in prosecuting the particular case at issue, that administration of psychotropic drugs is substantially likely to render the defendant competent to stand trial and substantially unlikely to have side effects that will interfere with her ability to assist in presenting a defense, that involuntary administration of such drugs is necessary to advance the government's interests because less drastic measures will not suffice, and that administration of such drugs is in defendant's best medical interest in light of her over-all medical condition. See id. at 180-82. Our Court of Appeals has held that it is the government's burden to establish each of these criteria by clear and convincing evidence. See United States v. Gomes, 387 F.3d 157, 160 (2d Cir.2004).





Based on the evidence presented at a Sell hearing on May 4 and May 9, 2006, for the reasons explained below, the government has failed to carry this burden with respect to one, and possibly two, of these criteria-possibly as to the importance of the government's interest and certainly as to the likelihood that the proposed medication will succeed. Accordingly, the motion is denied.







I.





A. The Indictment







Count One of the indictment charges Lindauer with participating in a conspiracy with two other named defendants, Raed Noman Al-Anbuke and Wisam Noman Al-Anbuke, to act in the United States as agents of the government of Iraq without notification to the Attorney General, in violation of 18 U.S.C. ? 951 (2000). The two defendants bearing the name Al-Anbuke are sons of a former Iraqi diplomat who have already pleaded guilty, been sentenced to time served, and left the United States , I believe for Iraq. Their charged conduct, as explained by the government in pretrial submissions, involved principally obtaining the names of expatriate Iraqis in this country who were acting against the interest of the Saddam Hussein regime, and turning them over to IIS. It bears emphasis here that it was never the government's theory that Lindauer participated in such conduct, or indeed that she even knew the Al-Anbuke brothers. Rather, she and they were charged together only because both allegedly conspired with IIS.





*2 Although it is concededly a risky business to judge the thrust of underlying charged conduct from the overt acts set forth in an indictment, the acts attributed to Lindauer in the indictment are the following: meetings in 1999 and October 2001 with IIS officers, at the latter of which she accepted an unspecified task; acceptance in January 2002 of $232.77 and on two dates in February of $311.10 and $270.00, respectively, for travel, lodging and meal expenses; travel from February 23 to March 8, 2002, to Iraq, via Jordan, and meetings there in venues that included the Al Rashid Hotel in Baghdad, where she accepted $5,000; a meeting in Manhattan where she accepted $200.00 for travel, lodging and meal expenses; delivery on January 8, 2003, to the home of an unspecified government official, of a letter in which she conveyed "her established access to, and contacts with, members of the Saddam Hussein regime, in an unsuccessful attempt to influence United States foreign policy." (Indictment 3n) Thereafter, she is alleged to have engaged in a series of acts involving an undercover FBI agent posing as a member of the Libyan intelligence service, all apparently directed at supporting what are referred to as "resistance groups in post-war Iraq" (Indictment 3o), by which I conclude is meant groups resisting the United States and its allies and the post-war Iraqi government.





Lindauer has been reported in numerous news articles to be a cousin, to a remote degree of consanguinity, of Andrew Card, a former White House chief of staff in the current administration. E .g., David Samuels, Susan Lindauer's Mission to Baghdad," New York Times Magazine, Aug. 29, 2004, at 25. Although Lindauer is reported in the cited article to have contacted Card during her period of contact with Iraqi officials, it is uncertain whether he is the unspecified "government official" referred to in the indictment.





The substantive counts of the indictment charge defendant with acting as an unregistered agent of the Iraqi government in violation of 18 U.S.C. ? 951 (Count Two); accepting about $10,000 from IIS as payment for "various services and activities," including her trip to Baghdad in violation of 18 U.S.C. ? 2332d (Count Five); and engaging in financial transactions with the government of Iraq in relation to her trip to Iraq in violation of 50 U.S.C. ? 1701 et seq. (Count Six).





From these charges, it appears that the high-water mark of defendant's efforts to act as an unregistered agent for the Iraqi government was her delivery of a letter in January 2003 to the home of an unspecified government official, in what is described even in the indictment as "an unsuccessful effort to influence United States foreign policy." (Indictment 3n)





The maximum sentence on the conspiracy count is five years; the maximum sentence on each of the substantive counts is ten years.







B. Defendant's Mental Status In Relation to This Case





1. Procedural Background







*3 At the instance of her attorney, Lindauer was examined initially in January 2005 by Sanford L. Drob, Ph.D., a psychologist. Thereafter, in May and July 2005, she was examined by Dr. Stuart B. Kleinman, a government-retained psychiatrist. In September 2005, she agreed to go voluntarily to the Federal Medical Center, a Bureau of Prisons facility in Carswell, Texas, to undergo examination and, if necessary, treatment. There, she was examined and/or her records and other documentation reviewed by at least two psychologists and two psychiatrists on the staff of that facility. In addition, her records and other documentation were reviewed by Dr. Robert L. Goldstein, a psychiatrist retained by the defense. Whatever their differences in diagnosis, or as to the efficacy of forced medication, all agreed that Lindauer suffers grandiose and paranoid delusions.


see site for rest of article...

www.arcticbeacon.com

Yetter said...

ah come on SOP..this has to be a cooked up conspiracy theory. It doesnt sound any thing like our loving , compassionate, truth seeking and judicial goverment.

habakkuk said...

Yep, thats right yetter, its just another hillusination of the conspiracy nuts. We should just all go back to cutting our lawns and watching college football and get all of our news from fox and cnn. Life is sooooooo good here in the good old USA....Apple pie, chevrolet, baseball, Its the American Dream...Ahhhhhhhhhhh. As long as i have my 24 hour espn i'm as happy as a bug in a rug..Ahhhhh

I can hear the mindless conversation around the office water coolers..... "hey bob, did you catch that game last night?? That was the best game i've seen in a long time...and i've seen thousands in the past 2 years"


We'd better wake up damnit!!

tcob247 said...

We'd better wake up damnit!!

You are just the person to do it habakuk

hey you gonna catch the ND v Penn State game today

habakkuk said...

Your funny tcob.

I love sports. I'm a U of Michigan fan personally. I played a lot of sports in my younger days. But lately, i could care less. I know it sounds crazy but the thought of my children in bondage haunts me.

habakkuk said...

Speaking of "children"...Hows your son doing? The one in the military.

dejavu said...

If you read the history of the Federal Reserve you will see that it is one big conspiracy. If you try to make THEM look they are the bad guys , well, they have the guns, and they have the jails.

Conspiracy

–noun, plural -cies.
1. the act of conspiring.
2. an evil, unlawful, treacherous, or surreptitious plan formulated in secret by two or more persons; plot.
3. a combination of persons for a secret, unlawful, or evil purpose: He joined the conspiracy to overthrow the government.
4. Law. an agreement by two or more persons to commit a crime, fraud, or other wrongful act.
5. any concurrence in action; combination in bringing about a given result.

try2brealistic said...

Yetter said...
beam me up scotty, there is no intelligent life here.


now yetter how can you say that?

just ask "laugh lots" to explain the brilliance of guilty till proven innocent, and

you will see just what comprehension level really means.

dejavu said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
tcob247 said...

habakuk

He came home for a two week R&R the last of July.

He went back to Ramadi and will be back home for good around thansgiving

His 4 years of service are up this time next year

He will not re-up


Interesting take on kids being in bondage if they are on a sports team

habakkuk said...

I'm not saying the sports team is bondage...i'm saying that the path our country is going will for sure put them in bondage if we dont do something. Their lulling us to sleep with the sports and entertainment.

Glad to hear your son is coming home for good.

laughing lots said...

try2berealistic the retard said:

just ask "laugh lots" to explain the brilliance of guilty till proven innocent, and

you will see just what comprehension level really means.
---------------------------------
You know what i mean you inbred retard! I am not even going to explain that since your to stupid to get it. All you are is a following numskull who can't think for himself..hahahahahahahaha!
Retard!

try2brealistic said...

sorry mate i couldnt refuse

laughing lots said...

Mogel the mullet said:
It's the prosecutions obligation to prove fraud charges. It's not K&S 's duty or obligation to prove
mogel the idiot said:
anything. If the prosecution can't prove their alleged fraud charges, the Defendants go free. This case will probably settle and there will be no trial.
-------------------------------
Hahahahahahahahahaha!!!
Your ignorant huh? Your dreaming.
Obviously you dont know what the hell is going on.
Since your obviously clueless i am not even going to explain what they ARE up to and trying
to do but deep down you really know(dont you?).If you think they are going to just be set free or not do jail time, you should be in there with them for stupidity alone.RETARD!
Oh and saw a picture of ya, love the mullet..lolololol.. white trash dorean wanna be freak!!!!!

DanFromMass said...

HI, I Don't usually respond to the blog but I have been a client since March 1995. I also instituted a Admiralty Commercial Claim and conducted a Notorial protest on the dishonor of no response, filed a UCC-1 with the Massachusetts Secretary of State on my Mortg. Co. and when they began foreclosure proceedures in January I did file a Complaint for injunction in the Massachusetts Superioir Court. I am in the court as inPropia Persona and have been doing well. I also issued a Bond on my exemption in January which the Mortg. co. accepted, but did not credit my account. The superoir court denied me my preliminary injunction, but the lawer admitted in open court that her client did not have the original note for my inspection as I had requested because the client had fallowed standard industry practices, pooled the note, and sold it to thier inverstors. Well with the injunction denied, but the complaint moving forward the Mortg. co. moved forward with the foreclosure proceedures. (In Mass, no court needed. It fallw under Article 9 of the UCC) I can not get the local County Registry to file any UCC-1's on my behalf. So to stop the Mortg. Co. and make them have to produce the Note as proff of debt I filed Chapter 13 Bankruptcy. Because the real property was located in the Trust with Dorean the court granted a relief from stay on the Mortg. Co. So I then withdrew my chapter 13 and had Dr. Fred get me a new Quit Claim and put the property back in my name. I then refiled Bankruptcy under chapter 7. This time the court came at me on a technicality that a Debtor can not file Bankruptcy more than once ini 180 days. A Debtor is defined as a person in 11USC. a Person is defined as an individual in 11 USC. An individual in 26CFR is defined as Legal resident Alien or a national of the US. The US is defined throught Code as Washington D.C., Porto Rico, the Virgand Islands, and Territories of the US. I claimed I was not any of those. So in Hearing thJudge cornered me by asking if I was a resident of Massachusetts. In order to be protected by the Bankruptcy Court you must be a resident so I said YES. But to be a Resident is to be RES, or property of the US, therefore I was deemed a Debtor and dismissed. In the superioir court the Mortg. Co. was now in default so I moved for Rule 55a default. Mortg. Co. had my default stiken from the record on technicallity that I did not serve upon the proper level of managment in the intial complaint service. So I was given time to properly serve claim. I have also filed notice of reconveyance on the county Record in connection with my Bond that I issued for Tender and discharge of debt. The Mortg. Co. brought a injunction and restraining order against me from filing anything on the county record and removed my Notice and the two quitclaims that put my property in the Trust. So Now they Hold a Foreclosure Sale that I verbally objected to through out the proceeding. I handed out Lawful Notices of Facts and had several friend pose as potential bidders on the property. One friend quilified to bid wiht a Promissory Nots, did win the bid, then had his Note rejected at end of auction and sold the property to the second highest bidder (the Bank). So now they move for a dismissal of my Superioir Court Case in which we had a hearinig. Again I bring up that there is no NOte, that there are 4 Affidavits on the record that are Unrebutted and Time Barred in regards to the stement made by the attorney that the Note was sold. They claim that they now have it. The judge now turns to the Mortgage. I state that the Mortgage is a Temporary Security Agreement to the Note. That the Holder in Due Course is the only proff of a debt. That the Mortgage must accompany the Note. The Judge starts looking through the file for a certifed copy of the Note. I state that I have seen a facsimily of a document labeled as a Note, but for the record the Documant did not contain my signauters. According to ucc 6-108 and Rules of evidence a copy is only admissable if the authenticty or validity of the signatures are not challeneged and I challenege the validity of those signatures. The Judge took it under advise ment. The next day the attorney entered in another copy of the Note, this time the back of the last page as well with the endorsement stamp "Pay to the order of Ameriquest" and stated that she had forst hand knowledge that this was a copy of the original and that those were my signauture. I responded that there was no evidence that this attorney was present at signing of any papers to have first hand knowledge of any signatures, and that there is no evidence that this attorney is qulified as a handwritiing analysis expert and that the signatures on the copy again are not mine. It has now been under advise ment for 4 weeks. During that time I have been in Distrct Court for my EVICTION PROCESS. My rights were violated there, and rushed to Trial in which the court would only allow the argument as who has a recorded deed on the County and did I recieve a Notice to Vacate. I lost that Trial. I have filed for appeal before the 10 day perioir for such filing expired, but I have no FRNs as I am not working, so I requested Indingency on behalf of the strawman. I had an evidentry Hearing the next day and the SAME JUDGE says I don't have any appealable issues. So then I stated that I don't believe he can be unbias in this istance as the 16 counts of my rights being violated were against him. He then asked the attorneys for the fair market value of the property as for the Use and Occupancy Bond to be held during the appeal process. They gave him a figure of $1200 per month. The judge then did grant my waiver of the appeal bond ($180) but did not waive my Use and Occpancy Bond and set the amount as $4800 for four months rent and gave me till Tuesday 9-5-06 to post that bond. This was done on the previos Friday 9-1-06. So on 9-5-06 I did post a registered bond based on my exemption for $4800.00 and it was accepted by the Clerk-Magistrate. I recieved the official NOtice on 9-6-06 by mail. Then yesterday 9-8-06 I recieved a ne w notice that the court has REVOKED by bond. And I have till 9-12-06 to post a CASH bond. Tomorrow I am filinig a Objection to the revocation, and notice and demand for deligation of authority, finding of facts, and finding of law to Revoke my Registered Bond. Also I am filing a Notice and demand for want of Jurisdiction, and a Notice and demand to stay Execution. I have offered a settlement offer to the bank ini the superior court case and they have till the end of the buisness day monday. If they do not accept my offer I will be demanding a summary judgement in the superior court on the issue of the note. In the mean time, me and my wife are packing and we have been accepted for an apartment but can not move in until oct.1. I hope I can at the least stall the execution till then, but even more so i hope and pray i prevail in the superioir court. oh, One more thing. if they do produce the original Note and it only has the one indorsement on the back they are in trouble, because the indorsement I do know about is to Ameriquest, but WM Specialty Mortagage did the forclosure and claim to be the holder of the note. In accordance with ucc 6-108, the note must be endorsed everytime possesion changes. I think I got them in Superior Court, and yest the indorsement altered the note, but according to Buiviers Law, it doesn't accually become a note, until it has been endorsed on the back. It doesn't nessarrialy mean that it has been cashed. It does, if the Fed stamp is on the back though. ok, enough from me....Good luck guys...I keep prayer for your endorance, and I admire your faith, and i pray for your victory soon. Can't wait to meet you both very soon.

habakkuk said...

Laughie you are truly our pet idiot. Everytime you are asked a simple question you answer with:

"I am not even going to explain that since your to stupid to get it...RETARD!! "

Gooood boy Laughie:)

neodemes said...

DanFromMass said...

HI, I Don't usually respond to the blog but I have been a client since March 1995

**************************************

1995? Gosh, you must be one of their 100 successful test clients... you know, the ones they had done before marketing the process.

vertyu said...

I don't think Scott and Kurt knew each other back in 1995

GR82BMOI said...

danformmass said…”I am in the court as inPropia Persona and have been doing well.”

Let’s review: You’re bankrupt, your home has been foreclosed and you’ve been evicted. Presumably, you’ve also lost the fee you paid Dorean for their “services”. Yep – you’re really kickin’ ass!

mogel said...

Retard said: You know what i mean you inbred retard! I am not even going to explain that since your to stupid to get it.
__________________________________
Can I use your "you know what I mean" defense, in front of a Judge, next time I need it. I like your wording there. LOL

mogel said...

DanfromMass: Please keep us updated on your progress in your fight against your lender.

You need to post more.

mogel said...

Greatobemoi: You forgot dan's ace in the hole that makes his disappointments to date a moot point & that is the lender that has foreclosed is not the holder in due course & therefore has foreclosed illegally upon him. How do you spell HUGE DAMAGES?


"One more thing. if they do produce the original Note and it only has the one indorsement on the back they are in trouble, because the indorsement I do know about is to Ameriquest, but WM Specialty Mortagage did the forclosure and claim to be the holder of the note. In accordance with ucc 6-108, the note must be endorsed everytime possesion changes. I think I got them in Superior Court, and yest the indorsement altered the note, but according to Buiviers Law, it doesn't accually become a note, until it has been endorsed on the back."